Canal Street Chronicles: An SB Nation Community

Navigation: Jump to content areas:


Pro Quality. Fan Perspective.
Around SBN: Has Kentucky Improved Since the Non-Conference Season?

If Sproles can, why not Bush?

Star-divide

If you’re like me, you watched the indy-san diego playoff game with one thing on your mind… If Darren Sproles can do that, why can’t Reggie Bush? Sproles, a smaller, less-expensive version of Bush, put the chargers on his back and ran wild Saturday night. He had 328 total yards, including 105 yards rushing (4.8 ypc). He was basically unstoppable. Everytime Indy had the chargers in a 3rd and long, Rivers would dump it off to Sproles who would make guys miss and occasionally break tackles to get the first. He had a great punt runback to set up the tying FG and got the winning TD in OT.

So, why can Sproles, a 5-6 181 lb scat back do all this and our very own Reggie Bush (6’, 205 lbs), not? There are a few key differences in their situations:

  1. Usage – During the regular season, not counting punts and kick returns, Sproles touched the ball 90 times in 16 games – 90. That’s it. Reggie had 158 touches in 10 games. Obviously the Chargers have LT and he’s the man. That leaves Sproles as the complementary back. He saves his energy for a few touches a game – and he makes the most of them. 5.4 yards per carry and 11.8 yards per catch (vs 3.8 and 8.5 for reggie). The Chargers don’t ask him to pound away on defenses.
  2. Style – Every back has a unique running style, but I think Sproles and Bush are similar enough to compare. Does Sproles hit the hole faster? Maybe. Does he dance less? Perhaps. But I did see some similar shake and bake in the backfield on a few plays, but no atomic piledrivers from defenders in the backfield. What gives? This leads us to the biggest and most important difference.
  3. The Offensive Line – Did you see the holes that Sproles had? In most cases he could race through the line and into the second level before anyone laid a hand on him. A stark difference from the Saints OL, where opposing DLs often holding meetings at the hand-off point on running plays. Sproles had the luxury of hitting the hole full speed, because he knows that more often that not, there aren’t 2 LBs waiting to posterize him.

So what does this mean for the Saints and Reggie. I think Reggie can be a more consistently dangerous weapon than Sproles is, if a two things change.

First, the OL needs to get worlds better. Personnel changes would help (Brown to RT and goodbye to Stinchcomb? A new center?) but at the very minimum, a competent OL coach is a must. When DLs aren’t converging on him before he touches the ball, Bush will be freer to make his magic.

Second, continue to late season trend to pound the ball with other backs. I know Reggie was hurt the last few games, but hopefully Payton has learned that an improved running game is crucial to our success. I think Bush should get as many or more touches, but limit his touches in the running game so that Thomas or another more physical runner can soften up the defenses.

And one last request for Coach Payton – throw the ball downfield to Bush once in a while, huh? He’s faster than most of the CBs in the league, so I doubt there’s a Safety or LB who can stay with him. Remember the NFC championship? Wasn’t that play fun? Let’s see more of that.

This FanPost was written by a reader and member of Canal Street Chronicles. It does not necessarily reflect the views of CSC and its staff or editors.

0 recs  |  Comment 34 comments

Story-email Email Printer Print

Comments

Display:

Amen!

I agree. Would like to make some comments however. I think that SD game is a model for the Saints as you infer. It is a tricky thing, though as there are only so many touches in the game and then there’s Colston, Moore, Shockey (I mean Miller) Henderson, Meachem, but you are right- San Diego did it the way we should and we need a pounder for between the tackles (Brandon Jacobs) . O line needs to improve on run-blocking and i agree and a premium O-line coach with more of a plan for blocking schemes such traps, draws, screen plays, etc would help a lot to make the run game better. I think with some minor to moderate tweaking and a commitment to being excellent, this O-line could become a good run-blocking group.

Although I agree that throwing the ball downfield to Buch once in a while would be great, and hopefully they do, it seems very few teams embrace this strategy, but I still think it would be a good idea even if it is an incompletion.

by Philinwood on Jan 7, 2009 6:57 AM CST reply actions   0 recs

flaw to arguement

I am pretty sure that its the same Oline there for whichever back runs.

Duece can do it.
PT can do it
Bush…

MT
Reward: Have you seen my Defensive Line? If so please contact the front office.

by MT_always on Jan 7, 2009 8:04 AM CST reply actions   0 recs

So...

Bush wouldn’t be any better behind the Chargers line? His style definitely doesn’t complement our o-line. Deuce and to a lesser extent PT are more powerful and able to hit bodies and drag people for a couple of yards. Bush isn’t going to do that consistently. He needs space, either generated by the o-line, or by catching passes in space.

These things are not in dispute (or I don’t think they are):

  1. Bush has a ton of talent.
  2. He can be a dangerous weapon when used correctly.
  3. We have a lot of money invested in Bush.

Therefore, we need to do what we can to get him the ball in ways to maximize his skills. Improving the o-line/0-line coaching would help our other RBs too, correct?

by SaintBevo on Jan 7, 2009 6:19 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

at what cost

change the Oline and make it open season on Brees.. or leave the Oline protecting him and let Bush learn to work with the team.

MT
Reward: Have you seen my Defensive Line? If so please contact the front office.

by MT_always on Jan 7, 2009 10:22 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

This assumes

that an o-line is in capable of both pass blocking for brees and opening holes in the running game. I prefer my players to be able to walk and chew gum at the same time.

by SaintBevo on Jan 8, 2009 7:39 AM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Sproles has two BIGGER and STRONGER legs

I’m not impressed with Reggie’s lower body physique and strength. Also i think another thing is, Sproles has to play hard to EAT, Reggie is set for the rest of his life

Rog Smoove

by YESSaints on Jan 7, 2009 2:23 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Sproles has indeed been impressive
Also i think another thing is, Sproles has to play hard to EAT, Reggie is set for the rest of his life

I don’t want to do any Bush bashing because he has contributed to some extent while here, but I agree with your point. I’ve seen so many players in the NFL taper off with their performance after signing into the big money (i.e. Aaron Brooks, Will Smith, Charles Grant, and to some extent Marques Colston) Of course, Bush was “in the money” the moment he joined the NFL. He seems motivated to perform well and I’m sure he thinks he’s doing everything he possibly can, but you’re right in that guys like Sproles who aren’t millionaires just yet seem to bring just a little extra sometimes because they are out to prove themselves worthy of the mucho dinero contracts. If this latest knee rehab keeps Bush out the beginning of next season, I don’t think I’ll be sad about it. If they get rid of Deuce (and I’m sure they will), I just hope they somehow bring in a big bruiser type back to complement PT’s running style, who seems more of a speedster with strength when needed. A tandem of PT and a Steven Jackson/Brandon Jacobs/Adrian Peterson type RB would seem like an extra scary combo for opposing defenses.

Go Saints!!!!

by satchmo26 on Jan 7, 2009 3:01 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

No problem

A tandem of PT and a Steven Jackson/Brandon Jacobs/Adrian Peterson type RB

Sure, let’s go get one of them since there are so many just laying around.

I, for one, would not attribute Bush’s issues to complacency or a lack of effort. I think it is more of a function of his style not meshing with our crappy o-line play.

by SaintBevo on Jan 7, 2009 6:10 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

I didn't say it would be easy...

but as long as we’re dreaming.

Go Saints!!!!

by satchmo26 on Jan 7, 2009 6:44 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Sure, let’s go get one of them since there are so many just laying around.

Actually, there are a couple available. Derrick Ward from the Giants is one. Both he and Jacobs are UFA and I think they will have priority for Jacobs. LaMont Jordan is another one too.

What we need is:
PT as every down back. (I’d like to see him put alittle more muscle weight on. Around 10lbs or so)
Reggie Bush as our man in space back. He has given us flashes of greatness before he ot hurt. (A couple of those early games had me thinking he found his NFL stride)
Bruiser Back to spell PT…. Derrick ard may be too expenisive for that though

"For us, there is no spring... only the smell of fresh wind before the storm."
-Conan of Cimeria

by tlsk1066 on Jan 8, 2009 1:29 AM CST up reply actions   0 recs

What I meant was

You named 3 of the top running backs in football – peterson, jackson and Ward (to a lesser extent). Those guys aren’t growing on trees. I do agree that a banger is needed and we should be able to get one relatively cheap.

by SaintBevo on Jan 8, 2009 7:41 AM CST up reply actions   0 recs

What's wrong with Mike Bell?

He showed some energy. He hit some people. I think he’s a keeper.

by stujo4 on Jan 8, 2009 9:00 AM CST up reply actions   0 recs

They run differently

When Reggie faces a defender, he tries to juke him—he stops or runs sideways, faking this way and that, trying to make him guess wrong. He attacks the defender’s head.

When Sproles faces a defender, he makes minute course corrections at full speed, continuing to move forward but forcing the defenders off balance just enough that he gets past. He attacks the defender’s balance.

I don’t think that style of running can be coached. Sproles simply has an instinct that Bush lacks. Bush’s lack of an aggressive, forward-thrusting running style wasn’t apparent at USC, when he played against much slower competition and had a comparatively much more dominant offensive line. In the NFL, it’s obvious…and don’t I look for it to change.

That said, if our offensive line can plow huge holes through the defense and spring Bush consistently, he’ll be a devastating weapon as long as his knees heal.

All in all, I think Gary Gibbs needs to be replaced.

Gary Gibbs Must Geaux!

by MtnExile on Jan 7, 2009 3:09 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

$460,000 is a lot to ME and if you're averge, you too

but to people like Reggie and the rest of the high paid players in the NFL, 460,000 is nothing. How about you tell me what Reggie’s salary was this year and you’ll see why i said what i said. He probably made, in just this year, more than a lot of people will make in their lifetimes. Sproles HAS TO perform to make his money and then he still might get screwed with the expected short lifetime of a running back. Reggie HAS ALREADY been paid! and i agree they do run differently, you are absolutely right, but Reggie can’t even run through the arms of D-Tackles, i’ve seen plays where a DT tackles Reggie with a reaching arm tackle when Reggie has already passed him. I’ve heard different running backs, both old and new, say that being a RB is all about your legs, and that is something that Reggie lacks. AND last but not least, it seems as though when everyone else gets hurt, we slowly bring them back to speed, well what has Reggie done to make us want to rush him back onto the field. If he’s hurt then he shouldn’t play or if he does, not as much. We should’ve learned that with the Aaron Brooks/Jake Delhomme situation.

Rog Smoove

by YESSaints on Jan 7, 2009 6:08 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Reggie has to play hard to EAT too

Watch him try to have a meal with that Kardashian girl

by MobileSaint on Jan 9, 2009 4:22 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

They run very similar

Look at the game i saw sproles juke a lot in the backfield and ive seen Reggie do the forward juke in the NFL and college infact ive never seen anyone cut like him but lets see what happens with the rehab.

Don't worry I got your back cuz...

by TAYDIGGA on Jan 7, 2009 6:44 PM CST reply actions   0 recs

"what has reggie done?"

Is this a real question? Ill let others answer that, omg!!! U act like he hasnt done anything.

Don't worry I got your back cuz...

by TAYDIGGA on Jan 7, 2009 6:47 PM CST reply actions   0 recs

by the way

this article is exactly what I was thinking while watching the game.

Don't worry I got your back cuz...

by TAYDIGGA on Jan 7, 2009 9:02 PM CST reply actions   0 recs

because bush sucks

and still thinks he plays against fresno state. sproles makes one cut and gets up the field and uses his speed, not trying to break the big one EVERY play. i hope you guys realize that reggie is listed as a RB and has NOT done anything as a back – split out, sure he’s dangerous. as a a straight rb, not so much

by DeuceisLoose926 on Jan 7, 2009 9:13 PM CST reply actions   0 recs

I was just about to reply to TAYDIGGA when you put this

I would never say that bush sucks, but i agree with your justification and it’s what i was saying in less words. They seemed to rush to give him CARRIES after his injuries. He can return all the kicks and punts he wants. I’d love to see him in A LOT more at split out (maybe permanently).

Rog Smoove

by YESSaints on Jan 7, 2009 9:21 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

trying to break the big one on every play

I don’t think Bush is as guilty of this as most think. He does this some, but I think what he’s really trying to do is get to open space, rather than taking the creases which are available. Often though, he has LBs and D linemen flashing into his vision as soon as he touches it.

By the way, saying Bush sucks is the greatest overstatment in history. He hasn’t been all we would’ve hoped, but sucked? I don’t think so. Vaughn Dunbar sucked.

by SaintBevo on Jan 8, 2009 7:46 AM CST up reply actions   0 recs

ok so maybe he doesn't suck

but he is average at best…when he plays.

by DeuceisLoose926 on Jan 8, 2009 12:28 PM CST reply actions   0 recs

you do know

That before he got hurt he had 8 TDs, right? Did you watch the Vikings game? Average?

by SaintBevo on Jan 8, 2009 12:44 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

average at best?

Quickest to reach 200 receptions in history. Punt returns, turning 5 yard dump-offs into 50 yard TD’s to take the lead or give us the game? Dude’s last few games were looking good. I don’t expect him to be fully rehabilitated by next season, in fact I see him in a new uniform in 2010. He’s young and the procedure takes time. Amare Stoudemire had the same procedure and he’s back to form. I don’t want them to rush it. If he has to take another year, let him do so. He’ll only be 25. He’ll be fine.

Don't worry I got your back cuz...

by TAYDIGGA on Jan 8, 2009 12:46 PM CST reply actions   0 recs

quicket to reach 200 receptions - awesome!!!!

HE’S A RUNNING BACK!!!!!!!! Who gives a crap if he has 200 receptions and most games averages six to seven yards a catch?? You guys think just because he has big play capability and makes them once in a while that he’s the best thing since sliced bread. He had the one good running game this year when he had I believe eighty yards being paired with Pierre. Why are we all so quick to forget things such as two punt returns in the second Tampa game which were both ten yard or greater losses in the fourth quarter? Oh, that’s right – he was playing hurt. I’ve never seen so many excuses made for a number 2 pick in the draft. And let’s not forget that he only plays in 70% of the games. Good luck to him in his acting career. I have a Bush jersey, too bad he’ll never be half the Saint that Deuce, Brees and others have been. I hope I’m wrong, but I just don’t see it.

by DeuceisLoose926 on Jan 8, 2009 1:12 PM CST reply actions   0 recs

What?

So catching 200 passes doesn’t count? When he had 8 catches for 100+ yards vs. Tampa and the game winning touchdown, did those count?

Does he lose yards on punt returns sometimes? Damn right he does. He must suck at returning punts. That’s why he ranks all the way down at 3rd in the league in yards per return. 3RD!!! Ahead of Devin Hester. Ahead of Joshua Cribbs. Ahead of Darren Sproles.

Perhaps I’m making some excuses for him, but it sure seems like you’re giving him no credit. I’m far from a Bush apologist, but I can’t for the life of me figure out why some people hate the kid. He seems like a hard worker and a good teammate. I’ve yet to hear him say “yeah my yards per rush average sucks because Stinchcomb is a f-ing turnstile” or anything like that. Those of you that think we’d be better off without him are crazy. We would be better off using him correctly, but he is sooo talented. It is beyond me that we’re salavating over Derrick Ward instead of him. Cut the kid some slack.

by SaintBevo on Jan 8, 2009 7:09 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

can't he change the game...

why confine him to traditions? In Sean Payton’s offense what do you expect? 20 carries a game with 1200 yards at the end of the season? Not gonna happen under Payton. Look who Drew Brees was chasing (so to speak) Dan Marino, you think the runningback in that offense was traditional? Seriously, I mean I understand judging by your name and the comments you’ve made about Reggie, that you aren’t a fan of his but lets put his career thus far into context.

Don't worry I got your back cuz...

by TAYDIGGA on Jan 8, 2009 5:08 PM CST reply actions   0 recs

don't get me wrong...

I’d much rather have Reggie than Derrick Ward. And believe it or not, I am a Reggie fan – I’m a high school teacher and have his fathead on my classroom wall. I do believe however that he has definitely underperformed and does hurt the offense at times. Maybe you’re right about using him correctly. If you’re going to give him 200 catches fine – but make him a slot receiver and use his as a rb at times. He is a good returner as evidenced by the minny game, although that doesn’t happen without his blockers, as does nothing else in football – as you mentioned with Stinchcomb. But, as a rb he does the same things that Pierre does, but not as well – and Pierre was an undrafted free agent. So, if you’re not going to use him correctly, then why not trade him and try and get some picks back? I just think he gets way more hype than he deserves – we certainly wouldn’t talk this much about reggie if he wasn’t a heisman winner and #2 pick in the draft.

and even if he gets say 15 carries a game and averages four yards he ends up with 960 on the season(playing 16 games, which he hasn’t done yet I don’t think – not sure on his rook year). but, he would need to improve to 4 yds, which he has yet to come close to.

by DeuceisLoose926 on Jan 8, 2009 8:33 PM CST reply actions   0 recs

Honestly

Imagine what we all would’ve done had the saints not drafted Bush. Unfortunately we thought he was gonna be all pro the next 20 years with a bajillion yards and 400k tds. Alright so i exaggerate it a little, but come on. Someone was gonna get stuck with a really high pick really high paid running back who just isn’t that great of a pure running back. What we need to be thankful for is that we have Payton. I know he gives him alot more carries up the middle and such than some of us would like to see but i don’t know of many coaches that would use him much better.

Bush is probably not worth a second pick in the draft as a running back thats true. What is true is that he is a second pick as an athlete. I’m pretty sure that if Bush could go into free agency right now, he’d be signed by the end of the week. When he’s on the field 9 times out of 10 he’s the best athlete out there. More screens, draws, flat routes, and such. He’ll be fine as long as we use him right.

by fruly on Jan 9, 2009 1:05 PM CST reply actions   0 recs

David Gladow of the Times-Pic
I LOVE Darren Sproles. I went to K-State and even have a chargers powder blue Sproles jersey. (don’t hate me) But isn’t he basically a better version of Reggie Bush? No sense going after him unless you’re going to cut Bush loose.

by stujo4 on Jan 9, 2009 4:39 PM CST reply actions   0 recs

Whoa

No turning back for David Gladow.

Get Sean McDermott!

by MtnExile on Jan 9, 2009 5:12 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Comments For This Post Are Closed


User Tools

The ultimate community for lovers of all things Black and Gold! The latest news, commentary, discussion, linkage and more! Join in the conversation now with all of your fellow Who Dats!
Start posting about the Saints »

Join SB Nation and dive into communities focused on all your favorite teams.

FanPosts

Community blog posts and discussion.

Recommended FanPosts

Pig_small
Taking apart Clark Judge, point by point
Andrew602_avatar_small
Advice From An Arizona Cardinals Fan

Recent FanPosts

Saintsfanjeremy_small
Worst to first?
Colston_small
How I helped the Saints win
Percy_small
Jersey's/Orders
Lombardi-trophy_full_small
Who should narrate the "America's Game" film for the 2009 New Orleans Saints?
Pig_small
Who are you happiest for?
Ept_sports_nfl_experts-255777827-1265610542_small
Opinions on fans and what makes a team great
Champ_small
Bronco fan....NOLA native
Robert_meachem_21_small
Upcoming Free Agents
Knight1_small
Top Ten Plays of the 2009 New Orleans Saints Season: What's your take?
Saints-logo-4_small
What Was YOUR Favorite Play?

+ New FanPost All FanPosts >

Latest NFL Headlines from SB Nation

Buffalo Rumblings
State of the Bills Roster: Inside Linebacker
Mile High Report
Horse Tracks - 2/10/10 - Off-Season Begins
Arrowhead Pride
Arrowheadlines: Chiefs News 2/10

Featured Poll

Poll
Which game was more memorable?
The return to the Superdome against Atlanta in 2006
265 votes
The NFC Championship game against the Vikings in 2010
767 votes

1032 votes | Poll has closed

We're on Twitter!

Click here to start following Da Chronic! Tweet, tweet!

Twitter-logo_medium


Head Coach

Lombardi-trophy_full_small Saintsational

Offensive Coordinator (Contributor)

Pig_small MtnExile

Small Hap Glaudi's Ghost

Saintslogo_small saints-nation