Sean Payton Getting Too Confident?
by Dave Cariello on Mar 24, 2010 6:00 AM CDT
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PrintWe already know that Sean Payton's success as head coach of the New Orleans Saints has been at least partly rooted in his headstrong attitude and determined decision making. The now famous on-side kick he called to start the second half of Super Bowl XLIV was as nervy as it was brilliant. Payton has modeled himself from the Parcells/Belichick style of coaching and natural self-confidence is a prerequisite for the position. Personally, I like that kind of attitude. It's not the only way to coach - for perspective, I would put former Colts head coach Tony Dungy on the other end of the spectrum - but I think it suits the game of football quite nicely.
Yesterday, the Times-Pic had an article about Tom Benson and how winning the Super Bowl has changed him as a person. Fortunately, Benson says he hasn't let it all go to his head...
"No, they've been working the hell out of me, that's all," he said with another laugh. "But it is really very nice, I guess you would say, that everybody's complimenting you about winning the Super Bowl -- and my comment is, 'It's a great thing for New Orleans and Louisiana."
Interestingly, though, he wouldn't say the same thing about his head coach, Sean Payton...
"I don't think so," he said when asked if he had changed. "I just noticed, you know, our coach is sort of walking a little high."
Not surprising really. After all, he's earned the right to gloat a little. Caymus-gate, anyone? But Benson's comments have got me slightly worried that the problem runs deeper and is more persistent than just some good-natured high jinks between two teams.
As stated earlier, I like my head coach to be of the headstrong variety. There's a fine line between dauntless and reckless, however. It's certainly not time to sound any alarms but Benson's remarks and Payton's actions do raise some interesting questions: Has all the success and attention of winning an NFL championship gone straight to Sean Payton's head? Could it have a negative effect on future coaching decisions he makes? If Payton was already a confident coach, is it possible he could become overconfident to the point of detriment?
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Could it have a negative effect on future coaching decisions? Yeah, sure it could. Will it? Probably…at some point. He’s not going to stop running reverses in odd situations, for instance.
But Payton’s not going anywhere. If his confidence becomes hubris, he’ll get taken down a peg, and keep on being Sean Payton. That took us to one Super Bowl; I don’t see any reason why it can’t take us to another.
Parcells’ Giants and Belichick’s Patriots both missed the playoffs the season after their first championship. But both teams eventually got back to the big game and won it. I’m not worried.
Nothing lasts, change comes, and things break.
I dont know how much imput Payton has in gathering info on college players(I know he has some)
As long as he buckles back down by mid april and gets his game face on.
I also think its the owner and GMs job to keep the coachs head in the right place. Probably just the owner doing what coaches are famous for, delivering a subtle message through the press.
KICK ASS every day!!!
Why would you say something like this to the media?
Benson will always be a dunce. If he’s truly concerned about Payton, talk to him in private. Be professional. Don’t make some chicken-s***, back-biting comment to the media.
Why shouldn’t Payton walk high? He took a rock bottom franchise that Benson tried to move to San Antonio and made it a superbowl winner in 4 years despite it’s owner.
I hope this doesn’t turn into a situation like Randy Meuller was a few years ago. As y’all remember, Mueller assembled a team that won the first playoff game in Saints history. Then he smartly traded Ricky Williams (supposedly against Benson’s knowledge/wishes). Benson then canned him because there wasn’t enough room in the organization for anyone’s ego but Benson’s. Tom needs to cut the checks, let Rita run the club, and stay out of Payton’s way.
In Breesus' name we play
by Breesus Christ Superstar on Mar 24, 2010 8:03 AM CDT reply actions
Did I miss something? I honestly don’t understand why you would construe “I just noticed, you know, our coach is sort of walking a little high” as “some chicken-s***, back-biting comment”. All I take that to mean is that, in Benson’s eyes, Payton is carrying himself with more confidence than he was before. Sure, someone can overdo it in that department, thereby giving it negative connoctations in hindsight, but how is the mere observation that it exists any more open to interpretation than the word “confidence” itself? That’s kind of like a music critic labeling a particular song an artist’s “breakthough hit”, when he’s been releasing singles for several years. “Surely this will spell the demise of his edge in the indie music scene!” some might draw from that. But did the critic’s words truly have any negative connoctations? Of course not. It’s just the way some pessimistic hipster views Top 40 music that draws the negative backlash.
"I was not on the boat in question." -Darren Sharper
In a word, yes
Either you missed something, or more likely, we have different interpretations of “walking a little high”
To me, that phase construes arrogance, not confidence (as you interpreted) and was derogatory in nature.
Consider the source: Benson. His ego and arrogance have nearly destroyed this team many times over the years. The only ego he tolerates is his own. I will never trust him. We would be the Superbowl Champion San Antonio Saints if it had been up to him.
Sure, he has every right to correct his coach, but don’t use the media. Keep it in the family behind closed doors. It doesn’t appear that he was even asked about his coach. On the other hand, for all we know, this quote could have been completely misrepresented by the author of the article. Which brings me back to my point: don’t use the media to air grievances. It was the using of the media that I found to be chicken-s***.
Personally, I like having a cocky coach. We’ve earned our swagger. I certainly agree we don’t need to read too much into this single comment of a single article. The sky is not falling, we’re just shooting the breeze during the off-season. Forgive me if I get a little nervous when Benson starts running his mouth. He has been too quiet for a while now and I had hoped it would stay that way.
In Breesus' name we play
by Breesus Christ Superstar on Mar 24, 2010 3:32 PM CDT up reply actions
How do you know he didnt. Benson signs the checks. Its his job to keep his coach in line.
Noting wrong with a foot in someones ass. Its actually good for us. We are people, we need wake up calls from time to time.
KICK ASS every day!!!
I hope he did
correct him behind closed doors. Just don’t make it public. Don’t be Jerry Jones.
Just because he signs the checks doesn’t mean Benson knows what is good for this team. We’ve got 25 miserable seasons to prove it. If signing checks made you a winner, Danny Snyder would be in the hall of fame.
In Breesus' name we play
by Breesus Christ Superstar on Mar 24, 2010 3:36 PM CDT up reply actions 4 recs
Rec'd it...
If signing checks made you a winner, Danny Snyder would be in the hall of fame.
Eat, drink, and be merry, for tomorrow we die!
WHO DAT?!
TWO DAT!!
by LA_No1_SaintFan on Mar 25, 2010 1:17 AM CDT up reply actions
C'mon, guys
This is the same guy who called the Superdome Special. He’s always been this confident, it’s just now that people are taking notice is all.
he will have his moments
when he pulls a couple victories out of his a**. but there will be the occasional double reverse fumble when were trying to eat clock. but i like SP’s attitude and playing style, id rather watch a high powered risk taker than stuffy midwest football anyday.
I like hamburgers!!
by DrewBreesManCrush on Mar 24, 2010 8:41 AM CDT reply actions
Win or lose, lets go out swinging. I agree.
For those who can't remember the uncapped FA rules, this link's for you.
IMO
He always was slightly cocky who made some crazy choices. Personally that’s what i love about him as a coach. I like the big bag of tricks. Sure it is frustrating as hell when it doesn’t work. But boy howdy it makes for some exciting football.
"I have seen women walk right past a TV set with a football game on and - this always amazes me - not stop to watch, even if the TV is showing replays of what we call a "good hit," which is a tackle that causes at least one major internal organ to actually fly out of a player's body."
what is the basis for this post?
Are you basing this question on Tom Benson’s comments to the media? I think you’re giving Benson too much credit. He’s a senile old man. I think Jim Haslett was a hard head never willing to make changes. Payton has never been afraid of correcting mistakes.
I understand the basis for the post. Confidence can be viewed in varying lights and it makes for interesting discussion. What I don’t understand is how anyone can draw on one specifically based strictly on Benson’s comment. It’s about as neutrally phrased as it possibly can be.
"I was not on the boat in question." -Darren Sharper
It's not based on just Benson's comment
though Benson has usually kept his mouth shut so this instance is peculiar.
It’s also based on the Caymus stunt, my own personal perception and maybe some things I’ve heard about him from people who’ve met him.
It’s by no means an accusation, just a gathering of facts to form a hypothesis. Very scientific stuff.
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by Dave Cariello on Mar 24, 2010 10:33 AM CDT up reply actions
To many big words
Dumb it down for those of us weaning ourselves off coffee.
"I have seen women walk right past a TV set with a football game on and - this always amazes me - not stop to watch, even if the TV is showing replays of what we call a "good hit," which is a tackle that causes at least one major internal organ to actually fly out of a player's body."
“I don’t think so,” he said when asked if he had changed.
I don’t really think it’s peculiar when you’re answering a pointed question. What’s the man supposed to say? “No comment”? “I plead the fifth”? He’s being asked for his take on how it’s affected Payton, if at all, and he gives an honest answer. Maybe you’re confusing him for Payton or Loomis. Those are the guys who are masters at talking in generalities and dodging direct questions.
As far as your personal perception of Payton goes, I certain don’t disagree with you. He’s a straight-up pr***. And if that’s not exactly what you were hinting at, I apologize for putting words in your mouth. That was the buzz as far back as his play-calling days with the Giants, and he quickly hammered that perception home with his knee-jerk trade of Stallworth — at least in my mind — when he first arrived. As I said before the 2009 season started, I’m not likely to ever care for the guy on a personal level. I can’t help but recognize the exceptional job he’s done here on the whole, though.
For what it’s worth, I think Tom Coughlin, Jimmy Johnson, Steve Spurrier and Nick Saban are all pompous f***s, too. Just to reiterate, I think he’s come a long way in terms of job performance, especially in getting away from his Xbox mentality and striving for a balanced offense. Beyond that, a spade remains a spade.
"I was not on the boat in question." -Darren Sharper
What’s the man supposed to say?
He could have ended it at, “I don’t think so.” Doesn’t have to deny it but doesn’t have to divulge either. But you’re right, I do appreciate his honesty and/or lack of filter. And you’re also right that none of this really surprises me. Payton has always been cocky and I like that, just as most of us do. Just don’t want it to go too far that it blows up in our faces.
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by Dave Cariello on Mar 24, 2010 11:16 AM CDT up reply actions
Actually...
Benson was asked about himself, not Payton. Benson just took the opportunity to take a pot shot at Payton’s expense. So that’s raised my eyebrow. Why even mention Payton?
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by Dave Cariello on Mar 24, 2010 11:41 AM CDT up reply actions
Ah, ok. I thought he was being asked about Payton. I still don’t view it as a pot shot, but I can see how it could be interpreted that way.
"I was not on the boat in question." -Darren Sharper
Little bit of a pot shot?
From the article…
And with that, he threw back his head and chuckled like a Super Bowl winner who can afford a laugh on Sean Payton’s dime.
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by Dave Cariello on Mar 24, 2010 12:22 PM CDT up reply actions
i think you're reading too much into it
that comment was made in jest. He cracked a big smile when he said it. I don’t think it was meant negatively at all.
by Andrew Juge on Mar 24, 2010 12:49 PM CDT up reply actions
That wasn't a pot shot chief.
I’m of the opinion you’re taking the quote out of context.
I highly doubt the owner of the Saints is taking shots at the man who just won him his first league championship.
"There are those that make it happen, those that watch it happen, and those that stand around and wonder what the hell happened." -- Drew Brees
Coach is too cocky
QB is writing a book. The will never win another game ever again. That is it I am going to become a Falcons fan. I just don’t trust these gys any more.
OR
We just won the MFing superbowl. Hell, even I am cocky. Could we at least wait till camp starts to talk about how this team is going to blow it. I get that it has been a slow off season. But damn man we just won the MFing superbowl. Everytime you start to question the team just repeat after me. WE JUST WON THE MFING SUPERBOWL. See don’t you feel better? I know I do
Erroneous! Erroneous on all counts!!!
Sean Payton is the man!!! He is the king right now and if he wants to beat his chest and let everybody know he is the king, then you go right on ahead and do it. I like it.
Peyton, I can eat Oreos faster than you!!!!
Jon Gruden just popped into my head
And George Seifert. But he doesn’t count, he was an inheritor. Oh hell, Gruden was too. I can’t think of another coach who “got lucky” (without inheriting a built team) and won a super bowl and then never did anything else. Need some help.
I'd rather be in some dark hollow where the sun refused to shine
Than to live here in Missouri
Ditka. But I like Hank Stram better. Hank was a strutter, a banty rooster after he won SB 4. Career went into a decline after that, but not in his mind.
Jesus1000, please don’t let Sean Payton become Hank Stram. Amen.
I'd rather be in some dark hollow where the sun refused to shine
Than to live here in Missouri
Look at that vest. Didn’t want anyone to know he wore a rug. Vanity, thy name is Stram. Not Payton. Please.
I'd rather be in some dark hollow where the sun refused to shine
Than to live here in Missouri
Watched "The Catch" last night
49ers vs. Cowboys, 1982 NFC Championship in NFL Network. Calling the game were Vin Scully and Hank Stram. And Stram was absolutely terrible. “Yeah that was a good catch. He ran down the field and made a double move and when the cornerback turned in he turned out and the pass was right to him.” Gosh, thanks Hank, I wasn’t sure I saw that correctly. I thought sure space aliens and antimatter were involved somehow, but thanks for clearing that up. No kidding, he was that bad. And he was 12 years further into the whole bad rug lifestyle. Ye gods and Jesus1000.
But the odd thing is: he really was a brilliant football mind. Mecom should have given him several more years.
Nothing lasts, change comes, and things break.
reading between the lines...
read this comment by Benson to mean “Payton’s agents have contacted the front office seeking to renegotiate pay”
I hope I’m wrong, but Benson would be making a negotiating strategy blunder by putting some less-than-veiled comments out in the media.
The man has to walk high
in order to make room for his HUGE balls!
"It's better to burn out than fade away."
by SaintsFan-KS on Mar 24, 2010 12:58 PM CDT reply actions 5 recs
This article makes Payton seem arrogant
I just saw an AP report titled "Payton, Saints look to avoid Super Bowl hangover.
Sean Payton has been showing off the Vince Lombardi Trophy at the NFL meetings this week, even taking it over to the PGA Tour stop at Bay Hill.
The responses have been mixed.
"It was like the Holy Grail," the New Orleans Saints coach said Wednesday of his visit to the Arnold Palmer Invitational.
As for the NFL owners, coaches and players who have watched Payton and the Saints hoist it everywhere from Bourbon Street to Disneyworld?
"I think they’re jealous," Payton said. "If you’ve never been to New Orleans, that Super Bowl party began 27 years ago. And it will never end."
They’re jealous, coach? He’s kinda sounding like one of those kids we all knew who liked to show off their new bicycles while claiming our old ones were pieces of crap. Still, he can boast all he wants, as far as I’m concerned. He deserves it and I’m not too worried about it leading to a let-down season this year.
"As soon as Tony (Dungy) said we had no chance, I knew we had 'em right where we wanted 'em"--Coach Sean Payton right after Super Bowl XLIV with the Lombardi Trophy firmly in hand. WHO DAT!!
by David "Satch" Kelly on Mar 24, 2010 2:44 PM CDT reply actions
What does “27 years ago” refer to? 1983 … was …
"I was not on the boat in question." -Darren Sharper
Puzzled by that too
Wasn’t that the year Benson bought the team? I’m just guessing here.
"As soon as Tony (Dungy) said we had no chance, I knew we had 'em right where we wanted 'em"--Coach Sean Payton right after Super Bowl XLIV with the Lombardi Trophy firmly in hand. WHO DAT!!
by David "Satch" Kelly on Mar 24, 2010 3:00 PM CDT up reply actions
No
This year was his 25th anniversary year of ownership. I’ve got the stupid gold coin with his mug on it to prove it.
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by Dave Cariello on Mar 24, 2010 3:10 PM CDT up reply actions
Nope, that was 1985
Anyone know what happened in 1983 that he may be referring to?
"As soon as Tony (Dungy) said we had no chance, I knew we had 'em right where we wanted 'em"--Coach Sean Payton right after Super Bowl XLIV with the Lombardi Trophy firmly in hand. WHO DAT!!
by David "Satch" Kelly on Mar 24, 2010 3:10 PM CDT up reply actions
He was drunk. Hoisting that fingerprint smudged trophy over his head, popping off. Like that little Irishman in Pale Rider with his big hunk of gold. Oh here’s the video.
Payton’s on the fast track to a bad toupee and terrible color commentating, I’m telling you.
I'd rather be in some dark hollow where the sun refused to shine
Than to live here in Missouri
I agree SATCHMO
and if I remember correctly, the kid showing off his new, shiny bike…..either had it stolen, or someone beat the sh*t out of it.
WHO DAT!!! (sue me No Fun League)
To Confident?
That’s a good one…. Let’s see…..Do I choose the lack of confidence evident in a coach, like let’s say… Jim Mora…who continuously played.. “Not to lose”?
Or one Like Sean Payton whose attitude seems to be ..“What do I have to do in this game, right now.. to WIN”?
You make the call
"If you ain't the lead dog, the view never changes"
Bum Phillips
There’s no difference, if successful. There have been many aggressive minded coaches over the years who have and haven’t won, just as there have been many conservative minded coaches who have and haven’t. Style of coaching is only criticized in hindsight, based upon failure. I think it’s also fair to point out that Jim Mora didn’t call the offensive plays. It was Carl Smith, for the most part. I’d also be willing to bet that Smith called more gadget plays per season than Payton has. Was Hebert’s first TD as a Saint an example of “playing not to lose”? It came on a throw from Guido Merkens on a reverse option.
"I was not on the boat in question." -Darren Sharper
Self-confidence
Imo, the basis for self-confidence is awareness of one’s own successes. This man is successful and he knows it. He’s earned his confidence, by Gawd. I expect his success to make him hungry for more. I do not expect him to sit on his laurels. BTW, if if ever get a chance to meet him, I’d like to give him a laurel & hardy handshake.
"Dang! The Saints won the Super Bowl!" - my wife, Meso "Happy" Hu Dat.
Maybe way of topic for some
But my first thought after reading this whole thing about self confidence, ego, swagger, balls etc. I had a platoon daddy in iraq who told it to us straight before we even started theater specific training. " I expect you all to walk with big balls and be damn near arrogant. But I expect it ONLY because you back it up with being the best damn platoon in this Company. The minute you walk or talk like you are all that and others out shine you, I’ll be the first one to put you in your place. I’ll go to the mat for you for being loud or staying out to late or pushing the limits. But ONLY if you make me shine and give me something to argue and back you up". With that in my head I say, let SP walk the walk. The minute he is walking the walk and being arrogant and the trophy belongs to someone else….put a boot in his ass. (not out the door, just a little corrective action)
Can't disagree
If the boot is needed, just make sure the BIG BALLS aren’t irrepairably damaged.
"Dang! The Saints won the Super Bowl!" - my wife, Meso "Happy" Hu Dat.
Yes and it should worry other Saints fans
because his attitude can be great for us but it can also bite us in the ass and before this year, people wondered whether his attitude was a major issue or not
We will win games because of it and lose some and him getting OVER cocky may result in us losing more than usual
my take on Payton
He’s crazy. Not necessarily in a bad way, but in a Mel Gibson in Lethal Weapon way. He’s unpredictable – sometimes it is too much, sometimes it is just right, but it is that unpredicability that gives him an edge. Calling that onsides kick to start the 2nd half was crazy… well-thought out, planned and practiced perhaps, but crazy. We’lll have to live with the occasional reverse with 1 minute left when a FB dive would do just fine to get the brilliantly crazy calls like ambush.
But the real reason that I’m not as worried about him being overconfident is his other dominant trait: killer instinct. I think Payton has that Bellicheck “I will crush you” attitude. He’ll always be looking for an edge, always be striving to improve and become dominant. Does that mean that he won’t occasionally be filled with hubris and do something dumb? No, but in the long run, I like our odds.
"But tonight the Superbowl belongs to the City of New Orleans" - Roger Goodell 2/7/2010
by SaintBevo on Mar 24, 2010 9:39 PM CDT reply actions 1 recs
BOOM! NEVER pick a fight with a lunatic. I love that crazy SOB!!!
Fat, dumb, and happy. Hell, two out of three ain't bad!
I Want To Die In My Sleep Like My Grandpa – Not Screaming and Yelling Like His Passengers.
by Just 'Nother Day on Mar 25, 2010 1:33 AM CDT up reply actions
Sean would go after Moby Dick in a rowboat and bring the tartar sauce!
Too confident or crazy? If he eats, who cares!!!
Fat, dumb, and happy. Hell, two out of three ain't bad!
I Want To Die In My Sleep Like My Grandpa – Not Screaming and Yelling Like His Passengers.
by Just 'Nother Day on Mar 25, 2010 5:27 PM CDT up reply actions
You state that
It’s “certainly not time to sound any alarms” before doing just that.
We’re making something out of nothing in regards to Benson’s comments. He said that our Coach is a “little high” right now. He didn’t say he was arrogant and full of himself.
I personally wouldn’t care if he was, however. New Orleans needs this swagger. Our team needs it, and if other teams buy into that swagger and mystique, the Saints have already won half the battle.
"There are those that make it happen, those that watch it happen, and those that stand around and wonder what the hell happened." -- Drew Brees
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