Canal Street Question: Should Reggie Keep His Heisman?
You didn't think we would go without discussing this, did you?
I will spare you too many of my opinions since I think our buddy, ESPN NFL South blogger extraordinaire Pat Yasinskas sums it up best and shares the same thoughts as me...
Let's be realistic, and honest, here. Bush was still a kid when the violations supposedly occurred. Blame the people who were running USC's program at the time, blame Bush's parents or blame the agents he got tied up with.
Blame Bush, too, but let's keep it in perspective. Bush isn't the first, or last, college kid to do something wrong. Not every college coach is Joe Paterno.
This isn't a Reggie wrongdoing so much as it's a problem with the entire system that condones it. But what do you think? Should Reggie be stripped of his Heisman? Will Reggie be stripped of his trophy? Even if they do take it away, does it really change anything he's done?
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If Brian Cushing can keep his Defensive ROY award, then there would be no justice in the world of football if Reggie Bush loses his Heisman. Cushing cheated his way to better performance. That entirely changes my view of who was the best defensive rookie. Nothing USC did changes the fact that Reggie Bush was the best college football player that year.
"I want to hand this trophy to the MVP of the Super Bowl -- and the MVP of the entire league.''
-- Saints coach Sean Payton, handing the Vince Lombardi Trophy to Drew Brees after Super Bowl 44.
Of course he should keep it............
Reggie was the best college football player that year. Period. It doesn’t matter if USC gave him extra benefits or whatever. He was still a kid. This is USC’s fault, not his.
WHAT???
I’m not arguing the “Bush should keep it” part. Whatever. Taking it from him 4 years later is meaningless, but he was the best player period? I beg to differ. Exhibit A
"But tonight the Superbowl belongs to the City of New Orleans" - Roger Goodell 2/7/2010
It's a whole year thing.
Not a one game thing. Reggies numbers and performance well exceeded the norms for a rb. They were more impressive than vy gelly’s and they were both undefeated so yeah. He clearly was the better player
by ReggieVilma on Jun 13, 2010 12:29 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions
Pre-reply
Undefeated in the reg season.
by ReggieVilma on Jun 13, 2010 12:34 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions
just plain wrong
if you want to have the argument that Bush was better, that’s fine. But to say that there is NO ARGUMENT???? Here are the numbers:
Bush – 200 rushes, 1740 yards 16 TDs (8.7 yard average); 37 catches 478 yards, 2 TDs
Young – 65.2% completion pct, 3036 yards, 26 TDs, 10 INTs; 147 rushes, 993 yards 12TDs (6.8 yard average)..
Young touched the ball on every play, the offense ran through him. He was the unquestioned leader, made every in-game decision, picked his team up when they were down and changed the entire psyche of his team. Bush was great, to be sure, but shared the backfield with 2 other future NFL first rounders, one of which a Heisman winner himself.
I don’t think that’s such a clear choice
"But tonight the Superbowl belongs to the City of New Orleans" - Roger Goodell 2/7/2010
self-reply
I still don’t care if bush keeps the hesiman, and from what I read, Vince doesn’t want it. He’s got his trophy.
"But tonight the Superbowl belongs to the City of New Orleans" - Roger Goodell 2/7/2010
I guess your right
What were the voters who casted 784 out of 892 first place votes for Bush and I looking at? … And Reggie already had his championship the year before and the heisman was icing on the cake. Stop trying to overhype the second best player. And saw em off. Haha.
by ReggieVilma on Jun 13, 2010 6:36 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions
missing the point
I’m not here to argue that Bush wasn’t the best player that year (I don’t think he was, but that’s my opinion). What I took issue with is the contention that there should be no argument as to who the best player was that year. As for the voting numbers, Heisman voters were swept up in the USC hysteria along with the media. “The Greatest team of all-time” was the subject of an entire ESPN series focusing on how badly they would beat every other team in history (“USC vs 85 Bears? I’m taking the Trojans!”). I guess we know how that turned out.
Regardless, the award is Bush’s. Vince has said that he doesn’t want it
Me? I’m quite content watching my Rose Bowl DVD.
"But tonight the Superbowl belongs to the City of New Orleans" - Roger Goodell 2/7/2010
Missing common sense
88% of voters can’t be influenced by USC histeria. They were influenced by Reggies highlight real and numbers, which were more imppressive compared to the average backs numbers than youngs were compared to the average qb. Reggie was clearly the more outstanding player and deserved the hiesmann.
young didn’t want the award because he knows he didn’t earn it.
by ReggieVilma on Jun 15, 2010 12:07 AM CDT via mobile up reply actions
That game was one of the best college games I've ever seen
Although Boise State and Oklahoma might take the cake. Sooo fun watching Oklahoma lose in a bowl game…again.
man after my own heart
"But tonight the Superbowl belongs to the City of New Orleans" - Roger Goodell 2/7/2010
Well, i think Bush was the best that year
But then again I’m a big USC fan, and your obviously a big Texas fan. So my opinion might be a little biased.
Of course I'm biased...
Bush was incredible that year, just think that Vince was a little bit better, especially considering he touched the ball on every play
"But tonight the Superbowl belongs to the City of New Orleans" - Roger Goodell 2/7/2010
I think he should keep it...
Don’t know if he will, but this sums it up very well!
This isn’t a Reggie wrongdoing so much as it’s a problem with the entire system that condones it.
I also agree with Pat Yasinskas’ feelings as well. I mean, you can’t tell me that Reggie is the first college athelete that had that kind of stuff thrown his way…
"The Saints made the right decision signing Drew Brees-not just in terms of his arm, but because of his heart and mind." - Marshall Faulk
Eh. Maybe it changes his eligibility to be on the field at the time, but it doesn’t change what he did once he was playing. Let him keep it.
If I am good I could add years to my life / I would rather add some life to my years.
so, the NCAA voided all the USC wins and postseason honors earned during the Reggie era, as Reggie has been deemed ineligible
because he was"paid" (use of a San Diego home, and who knows what other benefits) by USC boosters, etc, during that time through the LLC set up by that agent, right?
Have they stricken his name from the record books and voided all of Reggie’s statistics as well?
What I’d also like to know is this…what did Pete Carell (or Peter Colbert or whatever his name is) know and when did he know it? It feels skeevy to me that he slinks out of town with no consequences or sanctions…
We've got 27 ways to add up to 11 (players on the field). I came up with another one last night. -- GW
by Hans Petersen on Jun 13, 2010 11:58 AM CDT up reply actions
i think we are all very biased
if reggie had gone anywhere else but the saints, i would def think he should get stripped of his trophy.
alas, that is not the case, so i blame USC entirely. maybe this will just piss him off, and he will take it out on the vikes in week one.
I love it when a plan comes together! -Hannibal
by DrewBreesManCrush on Jun 13, 2010 9:02 AM CDT reply actions
we sure are
Not all Saints fans are Reggie fans. Not even on here.
And the days went by like paper in the wind
Everything changed, then changed again
No bias here, I think he should keep the trophy.
It’s not like he tested positive for performance enhancing drugs.
by Jshore on Jun 13, 2010 5:46 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
rec'd
because that’s exactly how i feel. taking extra benefits here and there doesn’t make you play better. that’s if he took any. I believe that USC is fighting the allegations.
Superbowl bound!!!...I know! do you?! Go Saints!!
by skinnykinney on Jun 14, 2010 11:24 AM CDT up reply actions
U bet he should keep it.
If anything, having his parents live by him in Los Angeles (I’m assuming that’s where it allegedly was) would take away from his performance. That’s two more distractions from him working on his game. Prolly not a big deal. But couldn’t help him. He should definately keep it. Vince Young said he wouldn’t take it anyway
by ReggieVilma on Jun 13, 2010 9:29 AM CDT via mobile reply actions
Didn't the Heisman Foundation state it would make the decision
based on if he were an eligible? Sounds like the decision has been made.
"...there would be no justice in the world of football"
Are you joking? Justice in the football world? Where?
Why does everyone concentrate on poor Reggie Bush, the mere kid? The real victims here are the student athletes who signed with USC in good faith and now see, first, their coach gone to Seattle, and finally, their team consigned to the lowest level of NCAA hell. It wasn’t their fault…but it sure as hell was Reggie’s. He may have been immature, and exhibited poor impulse control; but he knew what he was doing, and did it anyway.
I won’t cry any tears for Reggie if they take away the trophy that he was ineligible for. Maybe it will spur him to greater things on the NFL field.
I know who i am! I'm the dude playing the dude disguised as another dude!
boom
…but no rec. Take some personal responsibility, individual citizen! The corporation was basically just doing its job. YOU are to blame for not resisting temptation, young man! And don’t even try to plead ABSCAM entrapment, you rascal!
And the days went by like paper in the wind
Everything changed, then changed again
Here's what no one is saying:
No one knows what went on. We don’t know if Reggie was totally against it and has argued from the beginning with his parents about it. We don’t know what the coaches knew or what they told him to do. We just know the outcome. We know something went wrong. So, I don’t think it’s fair, although it’s pretty arrogant and presumptuous of people to label, project and assign so much to Reggie, USC and whoever without knowing the facts. In situations like this I can only go with what I know for sure. And I know Reggie should’ve paid the guy off instead of letting it get this far no matter what happened. Whether he agreed with his parents or not, he should’ve forked over that $300k quickly. But he didn’t.
I personally don’t think he should get the Heisman taken away, not after four years and not after he demonstrated that he was the best player “on the field”. But if it’s taken away, let it be. It’s a hard lesson but hopefully it serves its purpose to all the other universities and players that do this (believe me it happens everywhere).
Don't worry I got your back cuz...
Very Doubtfull
Reggie argued with his parents about them staying rent free being as they found that Reggie himself was given cash, limos when he wanted and I think they even said vehicles.
by cbkao on Jun 13, 2010 3:39 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions
Didn't feel like looking it up
But AJG did. Check out his FanShot and read page 4 of the NCAA findings. There it us in plain (legal) English. Reggie and his parents negotiated with the sports agent. Both receiving cash, vehicles, and transportation like I said earlier.
by cbkao on Jun 16, 2010 4:23 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions
Tay, everyone knows you loves you some Bush, but this is going too far. Are you suggesting that Bush didn’t know that he was forbidden to sign with an agent or accept compensation for his play?
We don’t know the details of what went on, but we do know the broad strokes: Bush, and his family, were given things of value in exchange for a promise to sign with an agency, while he was a student-athlete at USC. That’s forbidden by the NCAA, and even my cat knows that. It doesn’t matter how much he may have been against it, or how much he may have argued with his parents (do you really believe that?); what matters is, he did it. And he knew it was wrong. Or he’s dumber than a cat.
I know who i am! I'm the dude playing the dude disguised as another dude!
I think what he's saying is
There’s no pictures of people giving his family the gifts or receipts from agents of gifts. It hasn’t clearly been proven like a positive test does for steroids. I would like this proof to be shown to, if they have it.
by ReggieVilma on Jun 13, 2010 6:55 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions
The sad part is, if Reggie had paid Lloyd Lake(s) $290,000 for his services, we wouldn’t be talking about this today, or ever again. Reggie GAAAA!!!
Can't think what I've just said
Put the soft pillow on my head
I'm not saying that at all!
What I’m saying is people really don’t know what went on and assigning all these meanings and whatnot as if they know exactly what happened. I’m sure he knew his parents were doing it. But what if his father told him what his agent was willing to do and Reggie was like, “I don’t agree with this…” or something to that effect. We don’t know if Reggie’s parents were about to be on the street and this marketing dude saved them…we don’t know anything. So what I’m saying is, in these situations I tend to not make to many judgments because I don’t know and I leave it at that. All I know is that he was the best player on the field IMO and won the Heisman based on that and I really can’t comment too much on anything he did off the field, because I don’t know…
Don't worry I got your back cuz...
oh and you're right Mtnexile but you're missing my point
Which is, if you don’t know something 100% even if you have a little facts, its best to not make too much of a stinker about it. How many times have you ever been pissed about something someone did based on a couple facts then, before you snapped, heard the reasoning, truth and other sides and said, “hmm, its jacked up what happened but I’m glad I didn’t snap because i’d look like an idiot for doing so before the truth pops up…”
I’m just not one for making too many snide and presumptuous comments about something that I can’t prove 100% because I wasn’t there. I’ve seen it time and time again in the sports arena, people cast stones about things they have no clue about (Koby’s rape case, Michael Vick, Tiger Woods, Pete Rose). Sure, there’s facts and evidence but even then—what gives us the right. This isn’t about Reggie, I do this with people I hate. I just leave my harsh opinions to on the field stuff, unless there’s a huge confession and even then I’m more likely to side with the fallen than the fans that execute the judgdment…that’s all.
Don't worry I got your back cuz...
I think he should be stripped of it, then told he can have it back, as soon as he learns how to run between the tackles.
"I was not on the boat in question." -Darren Sharper
Oh cp
You still don’t get it
by ReggieVilma on Jun 13, 2010 12:25 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions
Pout, pout, pout.
Fat, dumb, and happy. Hell, two out of three ain't bad!
I Want To Die In My Sleep Like My Grandpa – Not Screaming and Yelling Like His Passengers.
by Just 'Nother Day on Jun 13, 2010 3:45 PM CDT up reply actions
The only poetic justice out of this whole mess....
is that Lane Kiffen gets the flying fickle finger of fate award. After screwing the football program at Tennessee, he gets to see what it’s like to be on the receiving end.
Ridiculous
to think he should stripped. Based on performance, he was human highlight reel that year. Huge difference between steroids and cash. Double rods to Kiffin and USC. What people see in that guy as a coach is beyond me. I’m completely underwhelmed.
You think you know, and you don't know, and you never, ever will.-Jim Mora Sr.
Maybe if he gets it taken away
He might try harder in the pros. He’ll have to go out and make a new name for himself and be more motivated to get a new award, like an MVP award. I do, however, have a problem with the NCAA rules regarding student athletes. College kids are usually broke, and as an athlete, nothing is guaranteed. There’s no guarantee that you’re going to make it to the pros. You could get hurt and lose everything. If someone is willing to pay your rent or buy you a car, let’s be honest, would any of us turn that down? This happens all across college athletics, but this is a big player at a big school and everybody knows what happened. He really didn’t do much to hide it and that is his fault. I think he probably will lose the Heisman, but I will be disappointed if he does
Peyton, I can eat Oreos faster than you!!!!
He didn't cheat on the field
He made some poor decisions off it, but they didn’t effect what he did on the field. Let him keep it, punish him in other ways..
Dextar Manley scored a "6" on his S.A.T.
But, he gratduated from Jack Yates High School in Houston, Texas and attended Oklahoma State University for four years prior to being drafted by the Redskins. When he was 30 years old, he admitted publicly for the first time that he could neither read or write.
While the extremes of the Manley situation may have gotten bettter, there probably isn’t a major college in the country with a successful football program that doesn’t, at the very least, allow a “liberal” application of passing grades to star atheletes. A university is supposed to be an institute of higher learning. As long as the NCAA continues to cast a blind eye to this, it makes any ruling they come up with regarding other compensation just look stupid.
What was your SAT score? Ha - joking, of course, b/c of your typo...LOL
We've got 27 ways to add up to 11 (players on the field). I came up with another one last night. -- GW
by Hans Petersen on Jun 13, 2010 2:15 PM CDT up reply actions
Are you serious about the "6"?
Is that even possible!?!?!?
Wanna say something? Sign up! It's free!
by Dave Cariello on Jun 13, 2010 2:45 PM CDT up reply actions
I think you automatically get that if you misspell your name
We've got 27 ways to add up to 11 (players on the field). I came up with another one last night. -- GW
by Hans Petersen on Jun 13, 2010 3:10 PM CDT up reply actions
Make that an "ACT" test.... whatever that is. He said it. Not me.
Dexter Manley in a 1989 interview explaining how he got through college without being able to read or write:
“You don’t score 6 on the ACT test and get admitted to college. But, I would always go to class. I would sit in the front row and try to get sympathy. I always befriended the teachers.”
How much of a role do we think his abilities on the field had to do with the sympathy he received?
maybe he studied for and was trying to take the SAT, but showed up at the ACT instead - oops
We've got 27 ways to add up to 11 (players on the field). I came up with another one last night. -- GW
by Hans Petersen on Jun 14, 2010 5:14 PM CDT up reply actions
what happens if he doesn't give the Heisman trophy back
do they have cops show and take it from him
Players who should be in the Hall of Fame: Pat TIllman, Dwight White, Donnie Shell, L.C. Greenwood, Ray Guy, Steve Tasker, Greg Llyod, Andy Russel, Cris Carter, Kevin Greene and Jerry Kramer
"It is better to offer no excuse than a bad one." George Washington
Canal Street Chronicles resident Steelers Fan
exactly
And would they give what’s his name a new trophy, or the one Reggie had if he gave it up?
Can't think what I've just said
Put the soft pillow on my head
REggie could say
“Here, you can have my Heisman…it’s right here.” (and as he reaches to grab it he – OOPS – he ACCIDENTALLY (on purpose) knocks it off the shelf and it falls to the ground and gets a big dent in it. Sorry, VY!)
We've got 27 ways to add up to 11 (players on the field). I came up with another one last night. -- GW
by Hans Petersen on Jun 13, 2010 9:01 PM CDT up reply actions
the Heismen trophy
is about who was the best player in college football,
that was Bush.Hes already been punished by haveing his games and championship taken away .if it was a integrity award or the honesty award I’d say string him up,if he did riods string him up,if he cheated then strip it.
it was him against them,on a feild so he deserves it
I think it's up to the people who award the Heisman to decide
whether Bush deserves to keep it or not. If anything, I suppose you could say that by doing what he did, Bush would have lost his eligibility the year he won the trophy. Yes, he was a kid, but we are sending a lot of kids to foreign countries to fight some of the most evil people on the planet in the most difficult of conditions. Bush was old enough to accept the consequences of such actions if he did what has been alleged. Personally, I don’t think it warrants revoking the award since other USC running backs who have won the Heisman have done far worse {cough} OJ {cough}, but then again if the Downtown Athletic Club feels very strongly about the award going only to players who were eligible at the time the won it, I understand their position.
“since other USC running backs who have won the Heisman have done far worse {cough} OJ {cough}”
The only thing Juice may have done wrong in college (to my knowledge) was pull a knife of a teammate and that allegedly occurred at CCSF, not USC.
"I was not on the boat in question." -Darren Sharper
Bush should voluntarily give back the Heisman
to save face. He was ineligible to play, technically a professional playing with ameteurs. Why would he want to keep an award that he shouldn’t have to begin with?
How many other players from other schools accepted whatever
the same years he played. Its been going on forever. Media hype. Lets make a story. No lets play ball. Now VY has slapped some turd in a bar in Houston so he can’t have a Heisman trophy anyway. Bush has enough problems keeping PT from taking his lunch money.
What wonderful little gifts April Fools Day brings.
~D's Pappy
I think they are trying to make an example out of him
What he did was obviously wrong but think about yourself at that age. If someone flashed all that in your face and you got to play the game you loved it would be pretty hard to say no. It’s hard to balance out your ego with such a lack of life experience. The person I am now would say no but at 18 years old God knows what I might have done. This is common practice in college football. All it is is an example to scare the bejebus out of other players.
Plus he has a superbowl ring now, it might bother him to have it taken away but when it comes down to it you are only as good as your last game in the NFL, so does it really matter?
"I firmly believe that any man's finest hour, the greatest fulfillment of all that he holds dear, is that moment when he has worked his heart out in a good cause and lies exhausted on the field of battle - victorious." - Vince Lombardi

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