Back to the Jammal Brown trade...

by GRlZZ on Jan 17, 2011 1:44 AM CST

Remember that trade we made with Washington? The details of the trade go a little something like this (according to ESPN):

"Washington owes the Eagles a third- or fourth-round pick in 2011 for McNabb, based on how the quarterback plays or the team performs. If the Redskins win nine games, go to the playoffs or McNabb gets selected to the Pro Bowl, Philadelphia will receive Washington's third-round pick and New Orleans will get Washington's fourth. If none of those happen, the Eagles will get the Redskins' fourth-round pick and the Saints will get the Redskins' third-round pick.

If New Orleans receives Washington's third-round pick, then the Redskins will get a 2011 fifth-round pick back from the Saints. However, if Washington's third-round pick goes to Philadelphia, then the Saints will send a 2011 sixth- or seventh-round pick back to the Redskins.

There is also a conditional 2012 sixth-round pick involved. Should Brown play 90 percent of the plays next season or get voted to the Pro Bowl, Washington will send its 2012 sixth-round pick to New Orleans. "

So lets go through this:

1. Redskins win 9 games? NO

2. Redskins to the Playoffs? NO

3. McNabb to the Pro Bowl? NO

- So as of those 3 "NO's", we get the Redskins 3rd Rounder, and we lost our 5th rounder.

4. Did Brown play 90% of the plays? Not sure...how do we figure this out? I'm assuming he did though...

5. Brown to the Pro Bowl? NO

- So if he did play 90% of the plays (he played in 15 and started 14), we also get Washington's 6th rounder...

Does anyone have a way to figure out if he played 90%? I tried and have failed numerous times...

...But anyways a 3rd rounder, 10th pick in the 3rd round...that's the 74th pick in the draft...not too shabby, ok the 74th pick hasn't been that kind to teams...but here are the gems found with the 74th pick in the NFL draft over the past 30 years (yeah I looked back to the 1981 draft): Justin Tuck (2005), Steve Smith (Carolina) (2001), Curtis Martin (1995), and Will Shields (1993)...yep that's it...in the past 30 years 4 players stood out to me...but hey maybe it's about time another future multi-pro bowl 74th pick comes around right? And don't even get me started on the 10th pick in the 6th round!

So will this trade work out for us? I sure hope so...

Poll

The trading of Jammal Brown...

Jammal who?

62 votes

Wish we had him back

24 votes

86 votes | Poll has closed

This FanPost was written by a reader and member of Canal Street Chronicles. It does not necessarily reflect the views of CSC and its staff or editors.

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Comments

As horrid as Bushrod was this season, he was at least decent last season. And with Brown waiting in the wings, and some extra draft picks to help us improve in the future, the trade was definitely worth it.

by FriarBob on Jan 17, 2011 9:43 AM CST reply actions

Agreed. Had you told me we’d get a 3rd round pick for an overrated LT coming off of season ending knee surgery, I would have jumped all over that. Especially considering that there was no way he was going to accept less than top LT pay going forth. The only way it would have worked out better is if we could have franchised or transition tagged him, and then the Redskins wouldn’t have bitten.

"I was not on the boat in question" -Darren Sharper

by coldpizza on Jan 17, 2011 10:14 AM CST up reply actions

Couldn’t agree more CP and Bob.
And could you imagine a young curtis martin clone at pick 74? That would do wonders for this team.

In Breesus' name we play

by Breesus Christ Superstar on Jan 17, 2011 9:46 PM CST up reply actions

with was he played on the right, correct?

they had a horrible off, although i dont know if jammal could be blamed directly… but they couldnt run or pass. im glad we made the trade

"As a Saint fan I watch ‘Gone with the Wind’ just to watch Atlanta burn" -Ralph Malbrough

by DrewBreesManCrush on Jan 17, 2011 10:56 AM CST reply actions

Sorry man, I looked everywhere, but couldn't find a snap count for Jammal.

Honestly…missing one game and not starting another. I doubt he hit the 90% mark.

"Aristotle was not Belgian. The central message of Buddhism is not 'every man for himself.' And the London Underground is not a political movement. Those are all mistakes, Otto. I looked 'em up."

by jeff.l.b on Jan 17, 2011 11:18 AM CST reply actions

Does it matter? For some reason I thought the snap count was for the 2011 season. Did I misread things?

But missing one game means he only missed 7% of the snaps IF the number of snaps in every game was equal. Which isn’t terribly likely. The question is whether that game had more or less offensive snaps than normal. If that game there were less offensive snaps than normal, the loss could be as low as 5% or so. And just because he didn’t start didn’t mean he didn’t play heavily in the other game. So I wouldn’t be too surprised if he did play 90% of the snaps.

by FriarBob on Jan 17, 2011 11:57 AM CST up reply actions

If it is for the 2011 season, you’re right, it doesn’t matter. If it was for this season, however, it obviously does. You’re right, it would only by 7% of the snaps on average, however, he missed at least part of one game and got nicked up a time or two as well which means the chance that he played 100% of the offensive snaps during the 14 games he did start are probably very low.

"Aristotle was not Belgian. The central message of Buddhism is not 'every man for himself.' And the London Underground is not a political movement. Those are all mistakes, Otto. I looked 'em up."

by jeff.l.b on Jan 17, 2011 12:17 PM CST up reply actions

Apart from missing that game I remember reading at the time he was nicked more or less all the time. Wouldnt be surprised if he didnt get to that 90%. Walter football only give us 1-2-3-3 and 7

Bring the metal....

by bondcrash on Jan 17, 2011 12:01 PM CST up reply actions

OK I know we lose the 6th to the Jammal trade. And I suspect the 4th is involved in our drafting of Tennant last year. Or it could have been in the Al Woods trade, but my recollection there was that we gave up our lower 4th and our 6th to move up for Woods. But Tennant was in the 5th this year and we had given that up previously for Morestead (which I still chuckle over, since it created such a MASSIVE firestorm and yet proved to actually be a very good move). That probably meant giving up our 4th this year to get the 5th last year.

So that explains the loss of the 6th and the 4th. But what happened to the 5th?

by FriarBob on Jan 17, 2011 12:16 PM CST up reply actions

Doh I misread the above. OK the 4th was from Tennant, as I suspected, and the 5th was from Brown. And I forgot all about the 6th being for David Thomas. For some reason I thought we were done with that last year when we gave up a 7th for him. Guess I misremembered or something triggered an escalation.

by FriarBob on Jan 17, 2011 12:19 PM CST up reply actions

Rnd.

1. Our own pick

2. Our own pick

3. Our own pick

3b. Pick from the Redskins for Jammal Brown

4. traded to Jaguars last year to move up and select OC Matt Tenant

5. traded to Washington to complete the Jammal Brown trade

6. traded to the Patriots for TE David Thomas

7. Our own pick

"Aristotle was not Belgian. The central message of Buddhism is not 'every man for himself.' And the London Underground is not a political movement. Those are all mistakes, Otto. I looked 'em up."

by jeff.l.b on Jan 17, 2011 12:20 PM CST up reply actions

So basically

All we have left are the good picks, and a 7th rounder that Payton seems to find something every year.

Offseason Motto: Burn the damn black pants.
"The future's so bright, I gotta wear shades." - Timbuk3
Canal Street Chronicles-you know you want to

by Jon Banks on Jan 17, 2011 12:29 PM CST up reply actions

Yeah I forgot about the David Thomas bit. As I said, I thought we had given up a 7th for him and we were done. Apparently I was wrong about that.

But this is why I would like us to start learning to play the compensatory game. If we got a couple of those we’d have a pick or two in the 4th or 5th even if we traded away our normal picks there. And then not only would PayLoo still have their shot to work their magic on the small schools in those rounds, but we could STILL complete trades for players when we needed to.

by FriarBob on Jan 17, 2011 12:34 PM CST up reply actions

Two picks spent on a DT that didn’t make the team, two on a punter, two more on a center. Forgive me, but I honestly can’t name 10 NFL players at any of those three positions worth two players.

"I was not on the boat in question" -Darren Sharper

by coldpizza on Jan 17, 2011 12:42 PM CST up reply actions

That includes Sedrick Ellis, which would push the DT pick count to four. Six, if you include Jonathan Sullivan (still a Loomis pick). I don’t mind trading up, but for God’s sake, make it for a position of relative importance. Case in point, Pat McAfee dropped to 222 overall in 2009 and has outkicked Morstead since.

"I was not on the boat in question" -Darren Sharper

by coldpizza on Jan 17, 2011 12:49 PM CST up reply actions

Huh? Tennant wasn’t two picks, he was just one. We didn’t have a 5th rounder (or anything else, the 6th was already gone with Woods) last year to use on him (because of Morestead). All we had to give up to get him was our 4th this year. So he was a one-pick deal. While so far he hasn’t proven to be worth it, I’m willing to wait another year or two and find out for sure before I slam them for it. You’re being too impatient on this one.

Now Morestead was technically two picks, but the price wasn’t the NUMBER of picks it was the TIMING of the picks. Giving up a 7th round pick “right now” (at that point in time) for one of the better punters in the league, better yet, one of the better kickoff specialists as well? And then giving up a 5th rounder (essentially a 6th because it was #32) for him the next year? MORE than worth it. The short term price was dirt cheap. The long-term price was still worth it.

Now you’re fully right about Woods. But that was mismanagement of the player more than anything else. The guy is starting to look pretty good over in Tampa and I wish he was still here. But he tried to lose weight, lost too much, and became useless to us in the short term. And we didn’t have room to hold onto him on possibilities. But he recovered fast and became useful again, and I wish we had been able to grab him back in time.

Also with Sed, we needed to jump over Cincinnati, who had a pretty critical need for a DT themselves. They were too stupid to realize this and drafted an OLB instead of trying to block our jump (worse yet, they didn’t even get an elite OLB either). Was it worth it? At the time, sorta, but only because of how badly we needed him. Now, it’s getting closer to finally paying out the way we wanted it to. If we can put an elite DE next to him, it will finally be fully worth it three years later. Better late than never, I guess.

by FriarBob on Jan 17, 2011 1:23 PM CST up reply actions

I feel better about the Tennant pick. For some reason, I thought we had used the 4th as secondary compensation in a trade up. I still don’t view Morstead as anything special. I mean, he’s performed adequately as a punter, but so do most punters in the NFL. As I pointed out, McAfee has a better net average and could have been had standing pat. Pakulak, who we got rid of, has bounced around to four teams since and has put up ballpark numbers throughout. One of the better kickoff specialists? How often is he even used in that capacity? Even if it was every kickoff, we’re still carrying a placekicker on the roster. It’s not like he’s saving us any money. As far as Ellis goes, I disagree about “how badly we needed him”. Quite a number of DTs could have been had at any point in that draft without giving up another draft pick. Again, in all three cases, it’s more the value of the positions we’re trading up for that I’m questioning, not the performance of the players themselves in hindsight. They’re all just so damn interchangeable. Maybe not to the point of overcoming a preference, but preference PLUS another warm body? I just don’t see it.

"I was not on the boat in question" -Darren Sharper

by coldpizza on Jan 17, 2011 2:10 PM CST up reply actions

Make that two cases, since you corrected me on the Tennant misunderstanding.

"I was not on the boat in question" -Darren Sharper

by coldpizza on Jan 17, 2011 2:11 PM CST up reply actions

Tennant is the new starting center for the Saints, Goodwin won't be coming back

Taylor Gang or wear a #6 Miami Heat Jersey in Cleveland

by AKAY47 on Jan 18, 2011 1:33 PM CST up reply actions

Just to illustrate, I would be extremely hesitant to trade Morstead and a draft pick for Mat McBriar, and I consider McBriar to be the best punter in the league.

"I was not on the boat in question" -Darren Sharper

by coldpizza on Jan 17, 2011 2:15 PM CST up reply actions

Well I did say “one of the better”, not “absolute best”, or even Stu’s favorite word “elite”. But I also think he’s up there pretty good. Plus he’s also a YOUNG punter who is likely to be with us for another decade or more if he keeps performing as well as he has. That’s not completely valueless.

And he HAS performed pretty well. He may not have the stats of some other punters, but he also punts about half as much as well. That affects every stat he has, even average ones (because he has less opportunities to make up for the occasional screw up), and especially so for cumulative ones like touchbacks or inside20s and such.

by FriarBob on Jan 17, 2011 10:33 PM CST up reply actions

even Stu’s favorite word "elite".

Show me where I called anybody “elite”. Other than jeff.

Out with the truckers and the kickers and the cowboy angels

by stujo4 on Jan 18, 2011 9:13 AM CST up reply actions

tried to do some math

Jammal Brown at least played in 15 games this season…and in those games the Redskins ran a total of 938 offensive plays.
-The one game he missed the Redskins played 64 offensive snaps, totaling 1002 offensive plays for Washington.
-That would mean if he did play every offensive play in which he played in every game (which he didn’t seeing as he started 14 out of 15 games played…but just hypothetically) this would equal 93.6% of the Redskins offensive snaps…
-…but seeing as he most likely didn’t play every snap of every game…let’s just say he misses a total of half of one games average amount plays (which for the Redskins was an average of about 62.5 plays per game = a guess of Brown missing 31.25 more plays)…including the 64 snaps he missed being out 1 game that would but his “total plays missed” at 95.25 plays missed out of 1002 total plays he “could have played”. And he played in 906.75 out of 1002 of Washingtons total offensive snaps..
-All this figures into about 90.5% of the offensive plays that Jammal Brown played in (according to my shotty research) which is pretty amazing if it does come down to being that close to 90%!

My brain hurts now…

by GRlZZ on Jan 17, 2011 7:02 PM CST reply actions

dude...

you just blew my mind!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qais_eGMnWk
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=39GH-nzrY_I&feature=relatde

by tlsk1066 on Jan 17, 2011 7:35 PM CST up reply actions

lol

and after all that…i’m pretty sure we’re not gonna get that 6th rounder…but you know what we should have done?:
All saints fans should have voted Brown to the pro bowl, no matter how crappy or good he did.. just to get that extra 6th rounder..that’d be another way the fans could help the team right?

by GRlZZ on Jan 17, 2011 9:21 PM CST up reply actions

All saints fans should have voted Brown to the pro bowl, no matter how crappy or good he did.

Hey, it worked when he was a Saint.

"I was not on the boat in question" -Darren Sharper

by coldpizza on Jan 18, 2011 12:08 AM CST reply actions 1 recs

lol

by GRlZZ on Jan 18, 2011 1:44 PM CST up reply actions

compensatory pick

Do you know if the saints will receive one this year ? Does a site make predictions about that ?

by gui_france on Jan 19, 2011 3:25 PM CST reply actions

Yes there is. Well actually there are TONS of them that make predictions, but most of them are completely pulled out of somebody’s rear end (like, for that matter, mine on Fujita… I figure we’ll get something for him, but it could be as low as 7th or even as high as 4th, because I can’t see any chance of it being the max, which is a 3rd… which is why I guess a 5th or a 6th).

But there was one site where a guy has been VERY close to accurately predicting them for quite a few years now. I had it bookmarked at one time. But now I can’t find the bookmark… thankfully Google liked me today and I was able to find him again pretty easily. Unfortunately, he hasn’t posted since April of 2010, so I have no idea if he’s even still around or posting anymore. It’s possible he’s retired or something… guess we’ll see in the next month or so…

http://adamjt13.blogspot.com/

by FriarBob on Jan 19, 2011 8:07 PM CST up reply actions