What Up With Dat?: Preseason Potpourri
Below are the rest of my answers to this weeks reader questions submitted Tuesday. Special thanks to all those that participated. Feel free to continue the discussion in the comment section below.
Do you think Joe Morgan makes the final 53 and do we keep Clint (Splint) Injuryram? - Big D.
I think Morgan will either make the final 53-man roster or will get stashed away on IR for the year. Clint Ingram probably will not make the team, though there is the possibility that he may be placed on PUP.
How does Joe Morgan contribute to the team this year? What do you think will be Morgan’s future with the Saints this year? - Catfish S.
See above. If he plays, I think Morgan contributes only minimally as a wide receiver, perhaps with some opportunities as a punt returner.
Is Sproles going to return kick/punt returns for the Saints? - Grounded C.
When the Saints signed Darren I would have thought the return duties would be his job to lose. But because we haven't seen him used like that so far this preseason and because Payton may value Sproles more in his offense, not wanting to risk injury, they may not plan on having him return kicks and/or punts. To make you feel a little better, Sproles averaged 24.6 yards per kickoff return last season while Courtney Roby had near equal production with a 23.8 yard average.
What are your feelings on the play of Drew Brees this preseason, and what do you think about all of the talk of a "steep decline," or any decline at all? - J. Henn
Well I don't think anyone is saying Drew is in "steep" decline. If anything, it's a long, slow decline. Do I think his best year(s) are behind him? Yeah, unfortunately. Does that mean he's no good anymore? Far from it. I think the bell curve below is a good graphical expression of my opinion of Drew Brees' career.
If you had to choose one of these predictions to come true, which would it be? 1) The Saints win the Super Bowl in 2011 and repeat in 2012 (Brees ties Brady for rings) but they then suffer a sharp decline and are once again referred to as the ‘A-word (sorry, I can’t bring myself to say it) for the foreseeable future. 2) The Saints never make it back to the Super Bowl, but continue with an impressive winning record and command respect as a team and organization for the foreseeable future. Any hybrid of the above is not an option. - Snowboard K.
This is a tough one. This may not be the popular opinion but I think I would actually go with option #2. Winning the Super Bowl twice again would be lovely but many more years of complete ineptitude would be miserable. Having an impressive winning record for years and years would still keeps things interesting and fun.
Who would you rather play for the Saints: Obi-Wan Kenobi, Spiderman or Wolverine? - Triple A.
I'd have to go with Obi-Wan on this one. He has the ability to control things with his mind. That seems like it would be a more useful super power than spiderwebs or adamantium claws, which I'm not sure would be legal under the current rules of the NFL.
Do you think the issues with the offensive line vs Houston are just from them needing to get used to each other? Or do we need to hope that the team brings back Goodwin? - Horp R.
First of all, Jonathan Goodwin is a gone pecan. He ain't coming back so you can forget about that as an option. But yes, I very much think the offensive line issues are merely a lack of chemistry and comfort. I expect their play to only get better and better as the season goes on, starting with the game tonight.
Safety/Guard/Tackle: I was just wondering if there's anyone still out there good enough (and unsigned) to address the Saints lack of depth at these positions. - Valmo
No. Anyone worthwhile is already on an NFL roster. Perhaps after final cuts, however, there will be someone worth picking up.
What do you see as the biggest current problem on the Saints? What do you see as the greatest current strength? - Programmer M.
Right now I think the biggest problem is their lack of depth at safety. If Malcolm Jenkins gets injured, I fear every game without him will look like the Saints playoff loss to the Seahawks last season. On the flip side, I think the teams greatest strength is the culture they've created both on the field and off; their attitude, chemistry, cohesiveness and veteran leadership.
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Sadly, Drew and my own ‘level of awesomeness’ seem to be on the same trajectory based on Dave’s curve. Of course, I never reached that level to begin with. So here’s to hoping Dave’s curve is wrong.
In Breesus' name we play
by Breesus Christ Superstar on Aug 28, 2011 7:31 AM CDT reply actions
Do you think Joe Morgan makes the final 53 and do
I do and he should. I’ve admired his productivity on the field. He looks hungry and wants to be a part of the team. And I like his attitude and work ethic. He wants to continue to work hard to be the best.
That's interesting. You know what makes me sad? YOU DO!!! Maybe we should chug on over to mambypandyland...or maybe we can find some self confidence for you YA JACKWAGON!!!!!!
(tears) Tissue?.....Crybaby.
How dare you?
Well I don’t think anyone is saying Drew is in “steep” decline. If anything, it’s a long, slow decline. Do I think his best year(s) are behind him? Yeah, unfortunately.
Listed.
Deal me another hand Lord, this one's very hard
Cmon
Call me crazy but didnt Drew lead us to a SuperBowl 2 years ago??? Then follow that up by completing 68% of his passes… 4600 yards and 33 TD’s… and I know he threw 22 INT’s but lets not forget the poor running game last season… a Defense that struggled and a pretty significant knee injury that Drew played through. And his playoff performance 60 passes for 400 yards and 36 points and its clear there is no decline… He simply needs help… Like all Elite QBs need help… We have a Hall of Fame QB in his prime!!!! Lets embrace that Who Dats. THERE IS NO DECLINE!!!!!
brace yourself.. damon..
cause stujo & c-pizza will be coming after you, shortly..
maybe we can see a poll.. call it the “stu-wagon” poll.. or something.. so we know where we stand, BY NAME, on this controversial subject..
i found it ironic, that stu, who started all this with a compelling post, with pictorial info about brooks and all, has somehow been enjoying the fire that followed..
came back & explain again.. where you stand, stu.. you have lost me..
now c-pizza’s stand (another mystery of our time..) will probably remain unclear, although he’ll manage to simply knock you down, based on some stats he has stashed..
come out and talk.. men..
by the 9th plague on Aug 28, 2011 10:38 AM CDT up reply actions
wins – down
attempts – up
completions – up
completion percentage – down
yards – up
touchdowns – down
touchdowns per attempt – down
interceptions – up
interceptions per attempt – up
yards per attempt – down
adjusted yards per attempt – down
yards per completion – down
yards per game – down
quarterback rating – down
sacks – up
sack yards lost – up
net yards per attempt – down
adjusted net yards per attempt – down
THERE IS NO DECLINE!!!!!
Clearly,
You can toga party, but you can't toga fish.
Are you serious.... statistics 101... you can establish a trend line using 2 sets of data....
Wins down??? 11 wins is the 2nd best win total Brees has had as a Saint. 2nd only two his 13-3 season….10-6, 7-9-8-8 so statistically 11-5 would be an increase…
Completion pct down? once again… he completed 68.1 pct of his passes… compared to years of 64. 65 and 67% years prior to his SB year….
It makes zero sense to compare last season to Drew’s epic Super Bowl season….Using your logic Brady is in decline… I mean he is only averaging 11 wins a game since the 17-0 50TD year in 2007… He is clearly declining… Oh yeah and Manning reproduced his 49 TD season… Maybe he is in decline also… Or maybe every season has a different ebb and flow depending on things that aren’t quantified in stats… Like injuries, injuries to key teammates, schedule, team success…
I wont waste my time going through the rest of these stats…. comparing 2 season to demonstrate a trend for a player with 10 years in the NFL is completely ridiculous.
Average Drews stats for his entire CAREER if you want to demonstrate a decline… not he GREATEST season compared to the following season….
D322, where have you been?
Pizza doesn’t use legitimate statistical analysis to back up his claims. He uses pseudoscience, fuzzy math and common argument fallacies. He’s not concerned about the truth; he’s only concerned with fooling you into thinking he’s right. Don’t be fooled.
But, then again, that’s why we love him.
In Breesus' name we play
by Breesus Christ Superstar on Aug 28, 2011 4:24 PM CDT up reply actions
Drew Brees in 2009 had one of the best statistical seasons of any QB in the history of the NFL
His 109 passer rating was good for 8th alltime
His 70.6 was #1 in the history of the NFL
6th all time Net yards per pass attempt
2009 was a special season. To say he declined because he didnt meet or exceed that standard is crazy. His use of stats to prove a trend are ridiculous.
Wins shouldn't be credited to a QB.
Otherwise, yeah he had a decline in performance from 2009 to 2010. I won’t argue against that, just that it’s a permanent “Nowhere to go but down” decline.
Canal Street Chronicles-A place of great Saints news and information. Oh and the stuff I write!
Bring back Aaron Brooks! He's the only one who can save us from the evil that is Drew Brees!!
^just that it's not a permanent
Canal Street Chronicles-A place of great Saints news and information. Oh and the stuff I write!
Bring back Aaron Brooks! He's the only one who can save us from the evil that is Drew Brees!!
2009 is whats called an outlier....
If you took all of Brees stats as a starter before 2009 and averaged them you would have a mean. I would be willing to bet a paycheck that if you compared Brees’ 2009 and 2010 season to that mean (average)… you would find that Brees 2010 season was above his mean… 2009 just happened to be exceptional. So its not that he declined. Its that he simply couldnt recreate the exceptional season he had in 2009… just like Brady couldnt recreate his 50 TD season or Manning couldnt recreate his 49 TD season…
Ahem,
http://www.canalstreetchronicles.com/2011/1/28/1962268/brees-stats-in-charts
Canal Street Chronicles-A place of great Saints news and information. Oh and the stuff I write!
Bring back Aaron Brooks! He's the only one who can save us from the evil that is Drew Brees!!
just went & read it.. well put together.. & compelling..
cold stats.. but it occurred to me that the position is too complicated to isolate it from the rest of the team’s performance.. too many variables that influence those numbers..
i suppose stujo and the rest of his “stujo-wagon-riders” will always hang their hat on the cold numbers.. (dissing, ambiguous, one-liner from stujo should follow up this comment)
by the 9th plague on Aug 28, 2011 6:46 PM CDT up reply actions
Can anyone explain how PUP works?
i.e.-
does the player have any say in this? – can he ask to be released instead in the hopes of playing for another team?
can a team put a player on the PUP if his injury is not severe or if the severity is debateable?
does he get paid and does he affect the salary cap?
If Pro is the opposite of Con, what is the opposite of Progress? Congress!
-Men's Restroom - House of Representatives, Washington, DC
The PUP more or less give a team the ability to keep a player that is unable to practice through training camp with out that player counting towards its 53 man final roster
Once a player is cleared and practices he is unable to go on the PUP list. Ivory will be on the PUP because he has yet to be cleared and practice… Porter if injured would not because he has been cleared and has practiced….
but what I wanted to know is if a team says the player is PUP, does he have the ability to contest that status
or does he have to just “go with the program” and be PUP? Lots of injuries are borderline and fuzzy as far as how badly they affeect the player’s performance. I would imagine mostly the player goes along either because he is significantly injured or becuase his injury might not be real bad but he doesn’t want to ruffle feathers of a team he is trying to be a part of. But, I waqs just wondering how it works in the big picture.
If Pro is the opposite of Con, what is the opposite of Progress? Congress!
-Men's Restroom - House of Representatives, Washington, DC
I have never heard of a player challenging their PUP status.... at least not openly
I would think the primary reason is because a player on the PUP is still being paid as if he was on the active roster. There is no benefit for the player. Even if he makes a stink and is cut ultimately he will be claimed on waivers and his contract is unchanged. And other teams are really funny about picking up a guy that couldnt pass his team physical.
I agree
and will add that the year AFTER a SB victory is pretty challenging. Considering that, he did pretty good.
I also like the way so many people say Bushrod sucks, Stinchcomb was injured, over the hill and ineffective, but the problem with the passing game is Bushrod-Stinchcomb Brees. Also, do you really think we had a running game that teams were concerned about when we were throwing Ladelle Battes, Joique Bell, Julius Jones, De Shawyn Wynne, and then our better RBs (Ivory/Bush/Thomas) who were playing banged up at 70 effectiveness?
If Pro is the opposite of Con, what is the opposite of Progress? Congress!
-Men's Restroom - House of Representatives, Washington, DC
throwing those RBs at them is what I meant.
having said that, I also think that the passing game to the RBs is a hugely important element of every team’s offense and we didn’t really have that last year in may games. Betts,Jones, Bell and Wynne were not up to our usual standards of RBs that could get us passing yards making us more one dimensional.
If Pro is the opposite of Con, what is the opposite of Progress? Congress!
-Men's Restroom - House of Representatives, Washington, DC
If he plays, I think Morgan contributes only minimally as a wide receiver, perhaps with some opportunities as a punt returner.
Is this under the presumption that Devery makes the 53?
You can toga party, but you can't toga fish.
Yes
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by Dave Cariello on Aug 28, 2011 3:32 PM CDT up reply actions
But because we haven’t seen him used like that so far this preseason and because Payton may value Sproles more in his offense, not wanting to risk injury, they may not plan on having him return kicks and/or punts.
I’m not buying into this. I think you’re on the money, as far as not wanting to risk injuries go, but only as it applies to the preseason. They already know what Sproles brings to the table as a returner, so why risk it? He’ll be the primary guy on both punt and kickoff returns in the regular season, or I’ll be very surprised.
You can toga party, but you can't toga fish.
me too.
In Breesus' name we play
by Breesus Christ Superstar on Aug 28, 2011 4:25 PM CDT up reply actions
Do I think his best year(s) are behind him? Yeah, unfortunately.
I’m….disappointed….Am I all alone?
Canal Street Chronicles-A place of great Saints news and information. Oh and the stuff I write!
Bring back Aaron Brooks! He's the only one who can save us from the evil that is Drew Brees!!
I don’t buy it. There’s plenty gas left in the tank.
In Breesus' name we play
by Breesus Christ Superstar on Aug 28, 2011 4:25 PM CDT up reply actions
eat more hummus!!
Thumbs up, everybody...
For rock and roll!!!!
by Hans Petersen on Aug 28, 2011 4:26 PM CDT up reply actions
in Dave, or Drew
..or….me?
Thumbs up, everybody...
For rock and roll!!!!
by Hans Petersen on Aug 28, 2011 4:26 PM CDT up reply actions
yeah, you just showed up
Thumbs up, everybody...
For rock and roll!!!!
by Hans Petersen on Aug 28, 2011 4:49 PM CDT up reply actions
You all seem to be focusing on the wrong aspect of Drew's decline, or at least my explanation of it.
You’ll note how much better I think he STILL is compared to the rest of the league. That’s what’s important. Just because he may not be as god-like as we’ve seen, doesn’t mean he’s still not really damn great.
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looked pretty good last night.
If Pro is the opposite of Con, what is the opposite of Progress? Congress!
-Men's Restroom - House of Representatives, Washington, DC

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