In Defense of Roman Harper and Gregg Williams

We were up 3, and the Falcons started on their own 10 (I think). Gregg started calling blitzes and Harry Douglas became Jerry Rice. Luckily for us, the Falcons settled for a FG and we went to OT. They could’ve gotten a touchdown and finished the game (like the 49ers did). You’d have thought that Gregg would’ve learnt his lesson from that game lol, guess not. This is why it’s so upsetting, because we’ve been in this situation before, yet the outcome is still the same.

This is why I’m happy Williams is leaving, he’s too cocky and hard-headed

Is the one he helped Alabama formulate for the BCS title game. Crap last week, worst this week. San Fran had ONE pass-catcher that realistically the Saints had to worry about at the end of the game and they left hm one-on-one.

The D did an incredible job keeping the Saints in the game considering the 5 turnovers. On another note, it looks like Greg Williams is going to leave, ESPN has a story up on it already. They mentioned Steve Spagnuolo and Mike Nolan as the short list for candidates.

There is a time and a place for everything. I champion the Saints’ aggressiveness but this was neither the time nor the place. Situational football dictates smart, conservative play. You don’t throw bombs or run bubble screens when protecting a late lead, and you don’t blitz in this situation and leave a Pro Bowl tight end like Davis in single coverage on your safety.

from nola.com.. I think this pretty much explains everything

Did Harper get out-muscled on game-winning Vernon Davis catch? Yeah, it wasn’t his shining moment and the coverage was weak. But he’s certainly not deserving of complete scorn.

That last catch looked as much, if not more, on the responsibilty on Scott Shanle….. just sayin’

I agree in a few ways Dave. But the thing that gets me, is that the defense and offense completely flip flopped in the game. The offense went from cautious to explosive and the defense went from shutdown to laxed. I don’t have any blame for Harper, to me he was the Defense’s MVP this year. He lead the team in sacks as a safety, that is un-heard of. I blame Gregg Williams’s defensive strategy at the end. With 40 seconds left in the game, why would you rush 6? That completely threw Jenkins under the bus and forced him to cover Davis perfect. Instead rush 3 and force the offense to throw underneath. The couple plays before they did that and it worked! I just don’t understand GW’s method at the end.

But I disagree on Williams. As many times as our offense won games without defensive support, it’s perfectly reasonable to demand that a defense bail out the offense in a game like this. This game shoud’ve been won. There’s some talent on our D, but GW doesn’t know how to utilize it. Some LB’s and a real pass rusher would be great, too.

I guess in the crowded place I was in last night I missed this, but does anyone know why Roby was returning kick-offs?

Gotta take a break from sports for a while. I don’t even feel like watching today’s games and I’m totally avoiding sports channels. I’m still kinda hungover from stuffing myself with beer and hot wings last night.

It was a great and exciting game and I’m as disappointed as anyone about how our D couldn’t hold the lead at the end, but Gregg Williams is a great coach and a large reason why we finally won a SB. Roman Harper is one of the best SS in the league. Yes, it all fell apart for us at the end, but the 49ers brought their A game and are worthy of the win. I truly believed for most of the season that the 2011 Saints were even better than the 2009 Saints. That loss in St. Louis looms tremendously large because it cost us the 2nd seed, the bye week, and playing this game at home. The road to the SB was much harder this year and we just blew our engine yesterday. It’s painful, but life goes on.

Let’s not lose our minds too much.

As soon as SF lined up he knew what was coming at our D, they went into Protective mode instead of attack mode. Our D line or Williams failed to shift the line or play to cover their O line. Not sure how accurate this is (but he has been watching football many more years than I) so I will just accept what he says he saw( as I am only truly watching the game passionately in the last 8 years or so). All we can hope for at this time is that we play better next year, correct our mistakes in both Offense & Defense, keep our great players from walking to another team (Colston, Brees just to name a few), and draft some great players. AND HOPE WHOEVER WINS TODAY LAYS THE WOOD ON SF NEXT WEEK!

There will be no cake and ice cream and hugs at 5800 Airline Drive when Williams packs up his desk and moves up river.

My reaction isn’t anger towards players or Greg Williams, but I do think it’s time to try a different strategy. 2009 was a great year and the defense has been better in 2010 and 2011 than what it was before Williams came on, but I think that two seasons with as few turnovers and sacks as we have had means that it’s time to try something different. If this defense generated a league average number of turnovers and sacks, we’d probably have been playing in the dome this week and might’ve been an historically dominant team.

Not to mention that we drafted a DE that was worth passing up Mark Ingram (and later trading up to get him) who was seriously unimpressive all season and that we had a rotation of what should’ve been the best group DTs in football (Franklin, Rogers, and former first rounder Ellis) who were below average. Rogers, Franklin, and Ellis combined for 0.5 sacks and no forced fumbles this year, which is 5.5 less sacks and 2 forced fumbles less than Ellis got in 2010 alone. We were a much better team this year than last (largely due to the offense being one of the best ever) and certain aspects of the defense got better, but it was overall worse.

Just like with Reggie Bush last year, no hate, much respect and appreciation, but time to part ways and try something else.

I’m proud of their effort to get back in this game. One of our best Defensive games. Save the last 40 sec. Said it last night, no real pressure from front 4 (all season), SF’s front 4 was stout and made Brees second guess and hesitate all day, so they could drop 7 in coverage.
If I could delete one play in the 1st H, Roby’s fumble, he’s just got to fall on the ball. Take the loss we would’ve been backed up deep any way. Roman Harper played well all yr, we know his weakness’ its up front pressure or lack of, that make d-backs look bad.

to the Rams to be Jeff Fisher’s D-Coord!

So, the search can begin, I say we should go after Steve Spagnuolo!

My view is that GW’s defense and defensive scheme was good enough to get us to the playoffs and got us to this 4th quarter with 5 turnovers by the offense. We did that well with an aggressive D and with 1:40 left IT IS NO TIME TO REINVENT A NEW DEFENSIVE STRATEGY. YOU DO WHAT GOT YOU THERE AND YOU DO IT WELL !! GO DONB SWINGING- DON"T GET PASSIVE!!

The bottom line is SF did something better than they usually do. They were better when it counted. Their defense sucked in th 4th qtr but their offense was impressive and got the job done. If Harper had jarred the ball loose, we have a whole different ending. It was pretty amazing that Davis made that catch- that’s why I think it was just destiny that SF won.

WE have the worst front four pass rush of any team in the pl,ayoffs and worse than many non-playoff teams. GW did the best with what he had to work with.

Great game yesterday huh………………Two plays on the “D” and we win……Five plays on the "O’ and we win. Unfortunately, these seven plays cost us the game. Not because the "O’ and "D’ did not play great but you all have to admit, That Niner “D” was great and we still should have won. It just did not work out so time to move on. We have an entire off season to see what Payloo does to rectify our defensive problems and I feel it will get done. Great year !!!!

not this year. If you watch other NFL games,almost all of the other teams have trouble with safeties covering TEs. Did you see even Tebow take adavantge of this? How about how many times the Eagles got ripped upby many teams this year. Good safeties are really, really hard to find and when they make a mistake, it’s big and evreyone notices. Where was Troy Palamalau last week- he ’s about the best there is.

Did you ever notice how many safeties Jimmy Graham has made look bad? Didn’t he do that like a few plays earlier?How about Tony Gonzalez at 40 years old? How about Shockey? Even Michael Higgins can come in a game last week and this, and hard play and still have a catch or two and a first down.

We have good safeties. What we don’t have is a pass rush.

need to find a new def cord who is just right.

After all the smack that was talked… This is now 2 years in a row the Saints have been sent packing by the lowly NFC West. Maybe next year this Brees guy will step up instead of getting outplayed by some no-namer Smith guy. Thanks Saints fans. Loved the expression on Payton’s face at the end of the game Karma mofo.

Although the D kept us in the game for 3.5 quarters, I am putting this loss on GW. He’s done a lot of good things for us, and his game plan for the NFCCG v. the Vikings was pretty much the only reason we won that game, but the fact is that he gave up two touchdown drives in about 3 minutes to Alex Smith and the 49ers offense. Smith has proven that he is definitely a good QB, but I don’t think he’s THAT good. The 49ers offense is not a quick-score offense. If the game had been lost on a slower, more methodical 4-5 minute drive with a FG at the end, then maybe it would’ve been a little more understandable.

But that’s not what happened. Smith drove down the field in a little under two minutes right after we had FINALLY gotten the lead. Brees/Graham get it right back. Then the D gives up another 1.5 minute TD drive, using almost the same plan as the previous drive: blitz and leave their best player in single coverage.

It just baffles me that a defensive coordinator in the National Football League would actually think to himself, “Hmmmm we just blitzed them into oblivion and left what is by far their most dangerous receiver in single coverage and it resulted in a 2 minute touchdown drive with the game and the entire season on the line. What’s that? We have the lead again? And even if they score a field goal it goes into overtime, thus meaning that we should do whatever it takes to avoid a minute and a half touchdown drive like the one we just gave up? Well, we better use the same strategy again.” I mean, why? Just…why? We were holding up pretty well on the last drive. They took 45 seconds to gain…what…25 yards? I’ll take that. GW won’t.

Rant over. Blarg.

I do not care if GW returns; in fact I hope he does not.

Pick a side, schizo.

last note I took last night was this:

“17-14 Saints stop Niners and long sack – PUNT and Sproles FUM on NO 26 5th TO” I circled “5th TO” in red and then put the pen down for the rest of the game…so much happened after that, but I was too frustrated to continue taking notes.

does anyone realize we didn’t blitz on the game winning play? We had 8 in coverage on like 4 receivers. Maybe we didn’t blitz enough.

and it would have been OT- advantage Saints. How can a game winning play not be in the end zone?

1. GW, his scheme and his attitude in general had a large part in our winning the Super Bowl. I will be eternally grateful to him for that season in general and that night in Miami in particular.
2. Yesterday, the defense kept us in that game and played probably their best game (although in retrospect I think they were helped by some awfully conservative play calling by Harbaugh).
3. I have been disappointed in the progression (or lack there of) of the defense in general since GW’s first year. I was hoping that the 2009 season was the tip of the iceberg and our defense would continue to improve. It has had its moments but overall I expected better.
4. I have been disappointed in particular in the development of the young DBs. I don’t know if coaching is to blame for that, and certainly the players bear the lions share of the responsibility. 2-3 years ago I thought that Tracy Porter was a young shutdown corner on the come and Malcolm Jenkins was a star. Jenkins has had an awful year and Porter hasn’t been the same since the Super Bowl.
5. I’m all for aggression, but it must be paired with common sense. I was totally fine with blitzing but you cannot let their best receiver beat you. The only player they had that was going to make those plays down the stretch was Davis. This wasn’t a pick your poison situation. Make Crabtree or Ginn or one of their WRS (who probably wouldn’t make our roster) beat you. Just not Davis.

I don’t know if GW is gone or not. If he is, I wish him luck and hope that we go get another top flight DC who can improve this defense. We don’t need to have the 49er’s defense to win championships. If it were a top 10 or 15 unit, we’re making our viewing plans for next Sunday.

Without the defense in the this game it would have been over long before it was. We HAVE to give them credit for that. Offense wasn’t clicking. Too many turnovers. Drew was still pulling for those long yardage throws versus sticking to what was working and didn’t get a real rhythm going until the 4th quarter. After being on the field for so long they were freaking exhausted plus you have to give it up to the 49ers offense in those last moments for calling the right plays.

In the long run though it has become obvious that GW’s style of defense is not working for this team. Bend but don’t break is does not match up with our high octane, hit them in the mouth offense or the mentality of this team. We need a defense that matches that intensity. I welcome a change.

that is quite different from a bend don’t break defense. You cannot be a blitz – oriented defense and also be a "bend don’t break defense ’ That is an oxymoron. They are at opposite ends of the spectrum.

Football is a team sport, so can only blame this loss on the team, not an individual(s). A chain is only as strong as its weakest link…same is true about the team. Need to find the weak links and get them improved/fixed, if we want to make a run next year…

In defense of Jason David, he led the Saints in INTs both seasons he played for us and was an excellent special teams player. That doesn’t mean I want him in my starting lineup going forth.

Dave, I also think you’re putting a little bit too much weight on this particular game. Most people who want to see Harper and/or Williams gone didn’t arrive at that decision based entirely on what transpired yesterday. I mean, Kevin Kaesviharn had four tackles, an assist and an interception against the 49ers in 2008. He was also burnt countless times in coverage and was an overall liability at his position. As I’ve said several times before, if you wish to champion Harper’s play making ability as a blitzer, fine. Use him situationally. Bulk him up and convert him into a poor man’s Thomas Davis or Mark Fields. There’s no reason he needs to be on the field as often as he is at SS. He doesn’t bring enough to the position on an every down basis to justify that level of utilization. A ton of tackles? Hoorah. Jay Bellamy had a ton of tackles, too. All that says is our front seven isn’t doing their job in bringing down the ball carrier.

this is a guy who says he is not really a Saints fan anymore, he’s a Saints rooter. What does that mean? He has dissed just about every Saints player from Archie Manning, to Mario Bates to Jon Vilma, Roman Harper, Colston, Harper, the list goes on and on. He knows how to stay just under the standards to not ghet banned. I am hopeful that
he posts something that makes you have to ban him. He’s a perfect example of someone with a little knowledge and a negative attitude who can just tunr ofss tens, hundreds, maybe even thousands. As much as I agree with you banning, Stu, I would much rather have Stu on this blog. There are so many here that wish coldpizza would go elsewhere. I hope he does. He’s miserable, negative and arrogant.

I’m not calling for G.W.s head but I am calling for his job. He knew the personnel that he had. However even knowing this he stubbornly kept to a system that they would be unable to play it effectively.

I’ll just focus on the last two drives. There is no way that you let the niners have man coverage. Just plain and simple. I would have very much liked our chances had we just played pass defenses, yes sell out to the pass.

The talent is definitely lacking. Vilma is aging and injured, Shanle is old, Dunbar is somewhat clueless, Smith is aging and slowing, Jordan was disappointing, Franklin and Rogers were invisible, and Ellis took a step back. Greer was pretty good. Harper was horrible in coverage and good at the things he does. Jenkins took a huge step back from being second team all pro last season. Everyone can say that they’re ok with him, but he took a huge step back and may not be instinctive enough to play Free Safety. Porter was bad.

The issue that I have is that even though there is a lack of talent, it is the coaches job to know the strengths and weaknesses of his players. Putting Shanle into coverage on a receiver is not a strength, so why have a scheme where he has to do that? That is a failing of the coaches to put their players in positions where they can succeed just to fulfill whatever identity that the coaches want to have.

And will be for the foreseeable future. If you’re lacking talent, then you try to compensate with a scheme. GW’s is one of the most complex in the league. 2nd in blitz, 1st in 3-8 (one of the reasons he wanted Jordan so much). With so many defensive-side newcomers this year and the lockout, it is not surprising (to me) that it took a long time for this defense to gel, but we are seeing better contributions from the rookies and 2nd-year guys. And guess what? if GW leaves, we’ll be starting this all over again.